Date   
Re: 1.5 cents from "the old school" from ---where's the beef thread

George Eichelberger
 


A couple of questions for “where’s the beef”……

Is someone “internet savvy” because they know DNS, DHCP, NTP, TCP/IP, UDP and a raft of other technologies or do you just have to use Google, Snapchat and email to qualify?

You gave some examples of “old school”, what do you consider “new school”? You basically said “prototype modeling” is old school, is just having “SOUTHERN” on a RTR model is good enough? Is attending a RPM meet, NMRA, NRHS or SRHA convention in that category? How about visiting one of, at least four, railroad museums with actual Southern Railway equipment in operation or on display? Would “new school” have ever built any of the accurate resin SR models or purchased a RTR “Big John” or waffle side box car?

Without any of that, why claim to be a Southern modeler?

I guess the question is….does “new school” do anything that does not use a keyboard or monitor?

Ike



On Feb 2, 2019, at 4:05 PM, milepost 131 <mp131.ghandrews@...> wrote:

I tried to just reply to the person who sent two cents- really.

So now I'm relegated to "old school"- guess new school is just "sort of : looks like what I think Southern should have been" ??

As one who still builds from scratch and cares about prototype-- (try to find an accurate Shake and take model of Bryson City  NC depot <g>  If your are correct about "us" not being savvy (big giggle) who are the  800 plus from the Yahoogroups? We were doing THAT more than a decade ago.

I "personally' don't think much of  "look what I just bought" posts where  folks can give a terse "Attaboy" message. Even more grating is when the purchase isn't even "Southern" just something with an incorrect Southern paint job. (call me rivet counter) Call me a troll if you must but if it isn't Southern and you don't know it... why post it in a group related to Southern  unless you are just in need of "fellowship."  I get my fellowship at "church" <G>

Guilty as charged- I've been modeling  a lot of years. I did it while making a living and raising a family. Sad to say my sons were interested in C&O (not CSX) N&W, and ATSF so I was even spending time with those road interests as well as their sports AND as a BSA leader. I had just as much time as my boys do now with their work and families.. I found the time. 

As for aging... I resemble that remark.
As you can see by this post ... I can even find time to do things on the net... I find the time if it is important for me. Tomorrow I might not reply until after the game... if then.

But if I am wrong and you are right.... then perhaps this group and maybe even SRHA have seen their day and we should just go out to an internet store and buy whatever is on sale ---no need to be interested in Southern Railway- it's old school

The Rolling Stones once sang "Its only Rock and Roll (But I like it)" So I guess this is close enough: It's only SOUTHERN Railway  (But I LIKED it) 

Now.... where is that N&W J .... I need to slap Southern green and gold on it. Maybe a red roof... get me some of them Attaboys and likes. Get myself modern and new.

Yessireee. Born Again in the RTR anything goes new world. Wooooweee!


Gordon Andrews
still modeling The Murphy Branch - June, 1942

1.5 cents from "the old school" from ---where's the beef thread

milepost 131 <mp131.ghandrews@...>
 

I tried to just reply to the person who sent two cents- really.

So now I'm relegated to "old school"- guess new school is just "sort of : looks like what I think Southern should have been" ??

As one who still builds from scratch and cares about prototype-- (try to find an accurate Shake and take model of Bryson City  NC depot <g>  If your are correct about "us" not being savvy (big giggle) who are the  800 plus from the Yahoogroups? We were doing THAT more than a decade ago.

I "personally' don't think much of  "look what I just bought" posts where  folks can give a terse "Attaboy" message. Even more grating is when the purchase isn't even "Southern" just something with an incorrect Southern paint job. (call me rivet counter) Call me a troll if you must but if it isn't Southern and you don't know it... why post it in a group related to Southern  unless you are just in need of "fellowship."  I get my fellowship at "church" <G>

Guilty as charged- I've been modeling  a lot of years. I did it while making a living and raising a family. Sad to say my sons were interested in C&O (not CSX) N&W, and ATSF so I was even spending time with those road interests as well as their sports AND as a BSA leader. I had just as much time as my boys do now with their work and families.. I found the time. 

As for aging... I resemble that remark.
As you can see by this post ... I can even find time to do things on the net... I find the time if it is important for me. Tomorrow I might not reply until after the game... if then.

But if I am wrong and you are right.... then perhaps this group and maybe even SRHA have seen their day and we should just go out to an internet store and buy whatever is on sale ---no need to be interested in Southern Railway- it's old school

The Rolling Stones once sang "Its only Rock and Roll (But I like it)" So I guess this is close enough: It's only SOUTHERN Railway  (But I LIKED it) 

Now.... where is that N&W J .... I need to slap Southern green and gold on it. Maybe a red roof... get me some of them Attaboys and likes. Get myself modern and new.

Yessireee. Born Again in the RTR anything goes new world. Wooooweee!


Gordon Andrews
still modeling The Murphy Branch - June, 1942

Re: interest as reflected by data -where's the beef

SouRwyFan
 

Personally I think most people that really build from scratch or care about prototype specific models anymore, like the old days before RTR items were so available, are old school and not so internet savoy. They can do the internet but don't get satisfaction from it like they do from creating instead of the "look at me" mentality of today. They usual get eaten alive by the trolls because they are legitmently interested in sharing info and fellowship instead of criticizing/attacking and then hiding behind a username. Also with life obligations (Family, making a living, aging) find that posting and following the internet very time consuming and taking time away from life's important issues. Just my 2 cents...

Re: interest as reflected by data -where's the beef

mike turner
 

Gordon,

I look forward to every post on these lists. My research is taking a lot of time and nothing is really ready to post/comment whatever. Yet.

Mike Turner

MP-Z35

On 2/1/2019 2:24 PM, milepost 131 wrote:

Where’s the beef?

 

 

I look at data and at trends.
Based on the following data either folks interested in Southern Railway are visiting some other discussion groups that are well “concealed” or interest in this “Fallen Flag” is in steep decline.
I even suspect the numbers in the Yahoogroups (and the one migrate) include a “goodly” percentage of very inactive members or some whose mail is “bouncing.”

 

Recent message counts:

At Yahoogroups:

 

                                 Southern_Railway                                           Southernmodeler


members                           896                                                                 825

messages:

                 October 2018       3                                                                   2      

                 November            1                                                                   9

                 December            2                                                                   6

                 January 2019       2                                                                   3

 

 

Groups.io

southern-railway-system (migrated? Files seem to be)


members 745


messages:

                        October 2018                       3

                        November                           11

                        December                             5

                        January 2019                      31



ModelingtheSouthern (no migration)


members 17


messages

 

                                      October        10

                                      November      8

                                      December      0

                                      January 2019 2

 

I’m personally interested in modeling so it looks like it is really falling  in limbo. Yes, I’m interested in the history (particularly- steam focus) and I know that has declined since 1953 <g>

 

So before every one climbs my back and wants to castigate me for my posting --- I have done a bit in past years.
And even my files transferred with the group that migrated INCLUDING the documents regarding Southern Railway paint from headquarters circa 1946!

 

Based on data it does appear the Fallen Flag is falling. Interest  is losing ground.


So.... anyone? Is there  secret group,

Gordon Andrews
STILL modeling the Murphy Branch June, 1942.

interest as reflected by data -where's the beef

milepost 131 <mp131.ghandrews@...>
 

Where’s the beef?

 

 

I look at data and at trends.
Based on the following data either folks interested in Southern Railway are visiting some other discussion groups that are well “concealed” or interest in this “Fallen Flag” is in steep decline.
I even suspect the numbers in the Yahoogroups (and the one migrate) include a “goodly” percentage of very inactive members or some whose mail is “bouncing.”

 

Recent message counts:

At Yahoogroups:

 

                                 Southern_Railway                                           Southernmodeler


members                           896                                                                 825

messages:

                 October 2018       3                                                                   2      

                 November            1                                                                   9

                 December            2                                                                   6

                 January 2019       2                                                                   3

 

 

Groups.io

southern-railway-system (migrated? Files seem to be)


members 745


messages:

                        October 2018                       3

                        November                           11

                        December                             5

                        January 2019                      31



ModelingtheSouthern (no migration)


members 17


messages

 

                                      October        10

                                      November      8

                                      December      0

                                      January 2019 2

 

I’m personally interested in modeling so it looks like it is really falling  in limbo. Yes, I’m interested in the history (particularly- steam focus) and I know that has declined since 1953 <g>

 

So before every one climbs my back and wants to castigate me for my posting --- I have done a bit in past years.
And even my files transferred with the group that migrated INCLUDING the documents regarding Southern Railway paint from headquarters circa 1946!

 

Based on data it does appear the Fallen Flag is falling. Interest  is losing ground.


So.... anyone? Is there  secret group,

Gordon Andrews
STILL modeling the Murphy Branch June, 1942.

Re: Southern E-8 Paint Colors

D. Scott Chatfield
 

My opinion from looking at photos is that the transition era green was a bit brighter, and the '70s era green was not only a little darker but also a tad bluer.


Scott Chatfield

Southern E-8 Paint Colors

SouRwyFan
 

Hi all,

I am working on another project and trying to gather info on E-8 paint colors.
Is the green paint on the E-8's as built different or the same as the green applied later on them in the "Southern Crescent" scheme of the 70's.

Thanks!

Re: [bbfcl] Southern 43000-series PS-1s

D. Scott Chatfield
 

I shot a fair number of these cars over the years, and in looking at my photos it appears the ones I shot were in brick service.  Does this conform to your info or experiences?


Scott Chatfield

PWRS/NARC Pullman 5077cf boxcars (HO)

D. Scott Chatfield
 

PWRS/NARC is Pacific Western Rail Systems and their manufacturing arm North American Rail Car, not to be confused with the prototype North American Car Company (NACC), a freight car lessor whose assets were bought by GE in the '80s.

Anyways, PWRS/NARC is releasing a model of Pullman's exterior post 5077cf PS-1.  Several variations actually.  One they are doing in their first release is the ex-Railbox 14000-series cars that were dumped on the Southern circa 1983 when Railbox defaulted on the notes.  (Or something to that effect.)  These cars were simply restenciled SOUTHERN and for the most part were used to hold down the rails on otherwise abandoned trackage for several years until being sold to Montana Rail Link around 1988 (if memory serves).  They just need to find one modeler who is modeling one of those long storage tracks and they'll sell out. Perhaps someone who loves modeling trees and weeds but hates turnouts and is scared silly by DCC?

But my real point in typing this is not the ex-Railboxes, but to suggest the idea of using their earlier 5077cf body (which they are selling as Penn Central and Conrail cars) to model the Southern's thousand car fleet of similar 5023cf Pullman boxes, several orders in series 32975-33974.  Like this one:

http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/sout/sou33897ech.jpg

The main difference from the Penn Central model is the shape of the sidesills, the type of door (I think all the 5023s came with Youngstown doors), the vents on the top of the ends, and the end ladders since the 5023s were built in early 1966 and thus had running boards.  

Oh yeah, the 5023s were only 55-ton cars.  I'd love to see the memos on that reasoning.  How many 55-ton boxcars were built after that?  (Not many.)

The model could also be used as a stand-in for the later, taller (Plate C), 5219cf cars in the 38000-series.

When I get my hands on one of these models I'll report back.


Scott Chatfield

Re: [bbfcl] Southern 43000-series PS-1s

D. Scott Chatfield
 

So that's how Pullman mounted the power handbrake gear box in the high position:

http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/sout/sou43022dch.jpg


Scott Chatfield

Re: [bbfcl] Southern 43000-series PS-1s

George Eichelberger
 

The reason Kadee has done only that car is simple…I think.

Until very recently Kadee has not made a Morton roofwalk. Although that was the far and away favorite of the Southern, for some reason the one group pf PS cars were built with Blaw-Knox rectangular style roofwalks. To Kadee’s credit, they would not sell a model missing that part. I expect now that they have produced Morton roofwalks (and brake steps?), we will see more Southern box cars from them. They have one coming out in January. I’ve pre-ordered a couple but I expect they are sold out already.

Another Kadee car I’d like to see in Southern is their 70-ton covered hopper. The issue with that is not the roofwalk, it is the roof. The hatch spacing on the Southern cars is not what they sell. I sent them the correct SR roof drawing several years ago, no luck on that yet.

Ike

PS To “test” metal roofwalks, they set concrete blocks on the ground at Hayne Shop, set a piece of roofwalk between them and had shop guys pile on until the Morton part sagged. As you might expect…we have the memos!


On Nov 5, 2018, at 6:43 PM, D. Scott Chatfield <blindog@...> wrote:

I did some digging on Kadee's website and it looks like they've only done cars from Southern's 262865-262899 series (assigned to CNO&TP).  These were 50-ton cars with DF loaders built in 1960.  Pullman lot #8586.

This makes sense from Kadee's standpoint since they started doing these cars before they had a cushion underframe.  But they could also do cars from Southern's 34903-34917 group, built in the same lot but with different internal fittings.  

And now that they do have a cushioned underframe, they could do the 43000-series cars.  Stick 100-ton trucks under them and Bob's your uncle.

I know I've seen a Kadee double-door 50-footer on a layout with a 43000-series number (maybe George's?) but it must have been a custom paint job, not a Kadee factory job.

Considering how many single door 50-foot PS-1s Southern had, I'm surprised Kadee has never offered one (at least to my knowledge, and there's none listed on their out-of-stock list).  Since they have done CofG and Georgia & Florida, whose cars were eventually repainted Southern, why not?

Scott Chatfield

Re: [bbfcl] Southern 43000-series PS-1s

D. Scott Chatfield
 

I did some digging on Kadee's website and it looks like they've only done cars from Southern's 262865-262899 series (assigned to CNO&TP).  These were 50-ton cars with DF loaders built in 1960.  Pullman lot #8586.

This makes sense from Kadee's standpoint since they started doing these cars before they had a cushion underframe.  But they could also do cars from Southern's 34903-34917 group, built in the same lot but with different internal fittings.  

And now that they do have a cushioned underframe, they could do the 43000-series cars.  Stick 100-ton trucks under them and Bob's your uncle.

I know I've seen a Kadee double-door 50-footer on a layout with a 43000-series number (maybe George's?) but it must have been a custom paint job, not a Kadee factory job.

Considering how many single door 50-foot PS-1s Southern had, I'm surprised Kadee has never offered one (at least to my knowledge, and there's none listed on their out-of-stock list).  Since they have done CofG and Georgia & Florida, whose cars were eventually repainted Southern, why not?

Scott Chatfield

Re: Southern 43000-series PS-1s

George Eichelberger
 

The aluminum doors on these cars were the result of Alcoa complaining to the Southern that they were a huge shipper but the railroad was not buying enough aluminum. The complaint led to aluminum doors, Silversides the all-door cars and Big Johns.

There are several memos on the problem in the archives. I suspect few of the aluminum doors lasted until the roof walk was removed, etc, fork lift drivers showed them no mercy.

Ike

Southern 43000-series PS-1s

D. Scott Chatfield
 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/DUPLICATE-SLIDE-Southern-SOU-43023-Box-Car-FRESH-Paint-Dallas-TX-1966/392145714875

Did you notice the 100-ton trucks?  I hadn't before seeing this shot.

I sure many of you have one of Kadee's double-door PS-1s with "aluminum" doors.  They must be popular because they keep redoing them.  Well, I don't have one, because I never shot one with aluminum doors.

I assume the aluminum doors were replaced when the running boards were removed, brake wheel lowered, and ladders cut down.  Is this a correct assumption?

Scott Chatfield

moloco Southern FGE = "The Beer Car"

George Eichelberger
 

All:

I trust it will be OK with NIck Molo if I forward his “Master Class” discussion to the group. I’ve posted it on the Southern Railway (not only “modeling”) group because of its business and operating information.

Nick always does the research needed to produce excellent models and background information to go along with them. His Southern leased FGE cars are superb models. As I have mentioned before, modelers need to support high quality manufacturers by purchasing their kits and RTR offerings while they are available.

I have always been interested in the large number of insulated box cars Fruit Growers built for the Southern. They include:

Southern 70-ton 52 ft. 6 in. Insulated Box Cars Built by Fruit Growers Express Co.
Southern 70-ton 52 ft. 6 in. SCUF Insulated Box Cars 650-899, NCP-177
SCUF Insulated Box Cars 201-299 and 585000-585199, NCP-188
CUF Insulated Box Cars 585200-585699, NCP-201
SCUF Insulated Box Cars 100-299 and 585000-585199, NCP-201-A
CUF Insulated Box Cars 584824-584999, NCP-211 and NCP-212
CUF Insulated Box Cars 585700-585923, NCP-211-A

I’ve suggested that Moloco might offer these but, unfortunately, they are unique to the Southern. As Nick pointed out, FGE was really in the car assembly business. They bought parts; roofs, ends, side and specialties fro multiple vendors and did final assembly at their plant in Alexandria, VA. The combination of parts used on the Southern’s orders were not used on other roads’ cars.

As Nick mentions, many of the Southern and CofG leases were for beer service from various breweries. The cars in the “New Car Programs” (NCPs) listed were almost all for cars to be used for a new Miller brewery under construction at Eden, NC. They have their own section in Book 2 of the upcoming SRHA 50’ box car book. (Photos or information about any Southern rolling stock are certainly welcome.)

A project at archives work sessions needs to be to review the NCP files to make sure the chapter includes all of the data we have. We’ll be at the archives at least twice in November and another two or three times in Dec. If you are interested in attending, send an email to archives@....

Ike

Begin forwarded message:

From: moloco <molocotrains.yahoo.com@...>
Subject: moloco Southern FGE = "The Beer Car"
Date: November 3, 2018 at 8:41:41 PM EDT
To: <geichelberger@...>
Reply-To: <molocotrains@...>


moloco Southern FGE master class
= "The" Beer Car
the numbers
Southern had 1179 insulated boxcars leased from FGE, that includes it's subsidiary lines, like Central Of Georgia or Norfolk Southern. Of those, 461 were of the 10-foot centered design with single rivet pattern like Moloco currently offers. Part of which there is a solid block of Southern cars that were assigned as BEER CARS. The beer companies serviced were Miller, Pabst and Falstaff.

the locations
During the era of these cars in service, Miller had several plant locations, firstly Milwaukee, then later Fort Worth in 1969, Albany, GA in 1979, Irwindale, CA in 1980, Elkton, VA in 1987. Pabst had a few plants itself, again in Milwaukee, Peoria, IL in 1934, Perry, GA in 1968 (railroad location was Pabst, GA). Falstaff was from St. Louis and other plants through acquisitions Omaha, NE (Krug, 1936), New Orleans, LA (National 1937), Fort Wayne, IN (Berghoff 1954), Galveston, TX (Galveston-Houston 1956), El Paso, TX (Mitchell 1956), Rhode Island (Narragansett 1965).

With the recent releases of FGE RBLs I wanted to continued the series of master classes and specifically it's relationship with Beer traffic. Southern was involved with many national car pools and therefore no stranger when soliciting beer loadings understanding the lucrative nature and year round revenues. These pools would involve multiple railroads that would serve these listed plants and then many distributors across the nation.

For this instalment of master class the focus will be for the two pairs of Southern FGE cars produced by Moloco. Two for Miller and two for Pabst. The Southern return route rectangle so common on FGE boxcars had return locations of Milwaukee, WISC on the Milwaukee Road for Miller Brewing and Pabst, GA on the Southern for the Pabst Brewing cars. The other cars produced by Moloco in the past that were in beer service were Rock Island General American RBLs for Pabst Brewing in Peoria, IL, which may also translate to the ROCK cars as well at later dates. Moloco RI #6508 was a specific car number of many that we know were in Pabst service. The EL GA RBLs assigned car numbers #68301, #68305, #68319 and #68351 to Miller Brewing, even though we didn't make those specific numbers in that run. The hometown road of Milwaukee Road most likely served one or all of the brewers in town, see the available Moloco examples below. We also believe but could not confirm Wabash, MODX, MP and WADX RBLs being in Anheuser-Busch service. We also believe the SOO General American RBLs we produce a few years back also were in beer service, but not sure out of which of the many upper Midwest brewers that they could have served.

We can speculate from the above information that these national brands were being delivered by these Southern cars to all parts of the country before more localized beer plants were set-up. Meaning that even the west coast and mountain time zones received Miller High Life and Pabst Blue Ribbon!


SKU #33054 SOUTHERN repaint AX 4-65 (2 car numbers) - re-weighed/repainted at the FGE Alexandria, VA shop in 1965. It has the brown end double stripe scheme typical of that era. Note how the rivet strip on the ends is prototypically painted yellow. It has it's typical application of Morton tread roofwalk, Moloco is the only manufacturer to produce this a roofwalk accurately with up and over roof rib profile. FGE cars of this era had their full roof painted silver as well, presumably for heat protection/reflection from the sun. Being a 1965 repaint it still has it's full height ladders.

SKU #33024 SOUTHERN repaint AX 1-75 (2 car numbers) - re-weighed/repainted at the FGE Alexandria, VA shop in 1975. Note at this period of FGE practice the cars were painted all yellow and the A end ladders were cut down and roofwalk removed. However, roofwalk brackets remained on the roofs, accurately produced. Note the diagonally stacked For Greatest Efficiency logo starts directly under the FRUIT for the all yellow scheme. It also has an ACI label and COTS.


SOUTHERN 791508 - Represents the 1965 cars in this case. SOUTHERN 791500 - Represents the 1975 cars. This close-up shows the return route railroad CMSTP&P RR for the earlier cars whereas the later car has SOU RWY instead. Look at the differences in the rectangular return route boxes; 791508 has a 5 line return route, whereas 791500 has a 4 line one typical found on later era cars. The Lading Band Anchor symbol on the door is present on the older car and has been removed on the all yellow car. This also highlights changing stenciling practices on the door data and positions. Even though the reporting marks and numbers seem to be in the same position on the car sides, the CAPY block and Insulated -Cushioned lettering have moved around slightly which is to be expected with a ten year gap. Ironically, the 1975 repainted cars has floor loading (25K) and L and R stenciling applied to the left side of the door opening. Paint data in the top left also matches the repaint date and type of paint used, a common FGE practice.

Surely some one drinks beer on your model railroad...Cheers!





POOL CARS - Above 4 examples of 3 schemes that we have produced that were to our knowledge were in beer service. Specific Rock Island General American RBLs were in the Pabst nationwide pool. Four specific car numbers mentioned above were in Miller Brewing service, our example shows how they looked. The other 2 cars represent most likely beer service cars in the Milwaukee area. These cars represent 1979 repaints of the distinctive yellow doored cars. Note the differences between these almost identical schemes. They still have the LRD lettering on the doors, albeit a lot smaller. See our previous master class on Milwaukee cars for the specifics.

I hope you've learnt something about Southern FGE boxcars and the partnership with beer service. We are glad to give an insight of what we go through to bring you the best products in the industry. We hope to produce additional runs of the RI and EL cars in the future, so one can fill out their beer fleet if they missed out the first time - Nick Molo, owner moloco
Remember that shipping is only $9.99 for 1-5 cars and FREE SHIPPING for 6 cars and over, for USA customers.
Copyright © 2018 moloco, All rights reserved.

molocotrains@...

Murphy Welded Roof

mike turner
 

Does anyone know of a source for an HO model of the Murphy welded roof similar to that shown in SF-5210?

These were used on the bay window Hayne cabooses similar to X-3115 (X-3099 - X-3178).

The MILW ribside roof has been suggested as a source but the edges would required significant rework since the desired roof width seems to be 8'. Both Intermountain and Exactrail have made models for the MILW and they seem available.

A Branchline NYC Despatch roof has also been suggested but a good photo has not been found to see how close. and they appear somewhat rare.

Thx.

Mike Turner

MP-Z35

Re: [bbfcl] An early low-bulkhead flat

George Eichelberger
 

Re: Bulkhead flat 115757 (Southern series 115750-115774)

An interesting car! The series was modified by Evans and renumbered in 1964 under Special Car Program (SCP) 754 from wood racks 120998-122997. They were 50-ton capy cars built in 1938-39 per diagram book page F-2111. (Available from the SRHA grab but there are not many left.)

The 120998-122997 cars were themselves rebuilt from 175000-176344 50-T D.D.B. gons.

The SRHA drawing list shows three drawings used for the modification. I’ll check the microfilm but they have not been scanned yet. (Scott, a good project on our next trip to Chattanooga.) The rebuild drawings include: SF-21257, -21316 and -21877. The last drawing shows the side sill modification. The photo of 115757 shows the plate welded along the entire side sill. (Note the photo also shows an 8-38 blt date that corresponds to the 120998-122997 series wood racks.)

With these cars’ “pedigree” there are a lot of drawings but I expect modeling one would be mostly a scratch-built project.

Ike

Re: An early low-bulkhead flat

George Eichelberger
 

We can research the data about the bulkhead flat but are people aware the slide being sold is from an Al Chione set? All his sets are marked as copyright? Selling someone else's work is simply not the thing to do!

Seeing things like this make us hesitate providing photos to anyone realizing they can post or sell it with no credit line.

I sat in on a presentation at Cocoa Beach a couple of years ago. The presenter, at the beginning of his talk, said "he did not have time to research who the photogs were for the photos he was using". I though that was "tacky" but when he flashed a slide on the screen and did not know anything about where or when it was taken, I filled in the details and explained that was MY photo that no one had asked for permission to use. He was indignant that anyone would question his right to use it. All I said was it would have been "nice" if he had done some research so he could at least explain what he was showing...or who took the photo!

Re: [bbfcl] An early low-bulkhead flat

D. Scott Chatfield
 


Tom Mack asked:

> any suggested starting point as a good basis for one of these cars?

I mentioned the fishbelly sidesills because I wonder if the old Athearn 40-foot flat might work if you cut off the stake pockets?  I don't have one to check.  Or just cut new sides from styrene.  Since the deck is just plate steel it's probably easier to scratch the body than modify an Athearn.  Besides, doesn't the Athearn ride too high?

Use the old Cal-Scale Hydra-Cushion detail set or shorten a Details West underframe.

I don't >need< one but I might build one for the heck of it.  I've already begun scratchbuilding a Trailer Train 68-foot bulkhead flat and plan to do a couple other Southerns, so what's another one?.....

Scott Chatfield

Re: [bbfcl] Southern P-S 50 ft Boxcars Series 5000-5499

George Eichelberger
 

All:

These cars are described in the first SRHA 50’ box car book so I won’t duplicate that information here. I did not reproduce the AFE that led to the cars’ being ordered but I am reasonably sure they were not for specific shippers. They were “Specially Equipped” (CSD 145?) so they were not free running or general purpose cars. The largest group of assigned cars appear to be 12’ PD cars to Quaker Oates in Chattanooga.

To say I have “bugged” everyone that produces high quality kits or RTR freight cars to make these cars is an understatement! All have expressed some interest but they have the same problem….apparently only the CofG and Southern bought this design (specifications were produced by the Southern). I have made the point that I think the CofG stencil scheme is one of the best looking ever done on a 50 ft box car (better than the “football”, IMHO). The manufacturers see that as limiting their market for this prototype. Of course, I argue that there are multiple versions and paint/stencil schemes, including Norfolk Southern, that could be done but they (understandably) need to allocate their resources to the biggest sellers.

I don’t know the total number of Exact Rail Southern waffle side box cars or Big John covered hoppers that were sold but the opinion of many model companies that “Southeastern Prototypes do not Sell” is hard to overcome. Modelers that say “that car is not perfect for the month and year I model” and do not buy Sou/CG/ACL/SAL/L&N prototypes when they are available are not helping.

The first SRHA 50’ box car book is less than two dozen copies from going out of print. As this is the second printing, it is not likely we will do a third printing, esp. when there are other books we are trying to finish. They are available through the SRHA GRAB at www.srha.net.

When someone tells me they “model the Southern” but they do not have a copy of the book, I wonder where they get their 50’ box car data from. Book 2 (1962-82) is about 80% complete and will be finished after we get the archives organized. The Southern 40’ box car book will be re-issued as a complete re-write. It will include all of the 40’ rebuilds.

Ike



On Oct 28, 2018, at 11:33 PM, D. Scott Chatfield <blindog@...> wrote:

[This was posted to the Baby Boomers Freight Car List.  Fowarded here to see if anyone has modeled these series yet.]

Tom Mack wrote:

>Southern received 500 of these interesting Pullman-Standard 50-foot boxcars in 1963:

https://www.railcarphotos.com/PhotoDetails.php?PhotoID=87048

>There are also good as-built photos of these in both the Southern and Pullman-Standard color guides.

> Has anyone ever done a model of these (or something close) in HO? Did any other roads get the same or similar cars?

and I replied:

The CofG got 200 nearly identical cars (series 3500-3699) at the same time, which makes me wonder if they were bought for a pool to serve a large customer.  Perhaps Ford?  These cars are basically 50-foot single-door versions of the 60-foot double-plug autoparts boxes built for the Ford Pool.  Athearn has made the 60-footers in HO and N, and I'm planning to shorten one to make a Southern 5000-class.  

One possible source for the 10-foot smooth plug door is the old Details West insulated boxcar.  Unfortunately this was the last carbody variation they did and the hardest to find.  The older Athearn and MDC plug door boxes have narrower doors.  Their might be a newer Athearn/Genesis or Walthers model with this door.  I'll have to keep an eye out.

I also added that the Southern's 5500-5572 are the same basic car but with 12-foot exterior-post plug doors.


Scott Chatfield