Date   

locked Re: Via Sleeping Car NYC to San Francisco via Atlanta-Montgomery-New Orleans!

Robert Hanson
 

"Objectionable class" of traveler?

Only on the Crescent.

Bob Hanson


-----Original Message-----
From: George Eichelberger <geichelberger@...>
To: PassengerCarList@groups.io; main@southernrailway.groups.io <main@SouthernRailway.groups.io>
Sent: Mon, Nov 23, 2020 10:18 am
Subject: Re: [SouthernRailway] Via Sleeping Car NYC to San Francisco via Atlanta-Montgomery-New Orleans!

My apologies for using the space and bandwidth but this attached letter from the WofA/A&WP provides probably the best explanation of why the they did not want the SF-Washington tourist sleeper included in the consist of train number 38 (Later known as “The Crescent Limited”). Connection times in New Orleans were not (!) the reason…”inferior class of travel” was!

Ike


locked Re: Via Sleeping Car NYC to San Francisco via Atlanta-Montgomery-New Orleans!

John Stewart
 

Hi folks

Now I'm curious...

What is a "tourist sleeper"?

John Stewart
Birmingham, AL


locked Re: Via Sleeping Car NYC to San Francisco via Atlanta-Montgomery-New Orleans!

George Eichelberger
 

My apologies for using the space and bandwidth but this attached letter from the WofA/A&WP provides probably the best explanation of why the they did not want the SF-Washington tourist sleeper included in the consist of train number 38 (Later known as “The Crescent Limited”). Connection times in New Orleans were not (!) the reason…”inferior class of travel” was!

Ike


locked Re: Southern passenger cars on Winston-Salem division mixed trains

A&Y Dave in MD
 

James,

I looked there, but saw none of the passenger cars with those numbers, even though they were heavyweights.  There are fascinating photos on the site, including a wonderful yard image.  But nothing on these cars.  I wouldn't be surprised if they were older wooden cars.

Best,

Dave

Sunday, November 22, 2020, 11:29:09 PM, you wrote:


Dave,

I will refer you to this site which I think we have discussed before.  This the Forsyth County, NC public library photo site.

https://www.digitalforsyth.org

I generally search trains or railroad.  You will get photos of Southern, Norfolk Western and Norfolk Southern.
A Rural Hall or North Wilkesboro search might narrow it down.  I do know there are photos of the Southern’s last
passenger train to North Wilkesboro.

James Wall
Rural Hall, NC




--
David Bott

Sent from David Bott's desktop PC


locked Re: Southern passenger cars on Winston-Salem division mixed trains

James
 

Dave,

I will refer you to this site which I think we have discussed before.  This the Forsyth County, NC public library photo site.


I generally search trains or railroad.  You will get photos of Southern, Norfolk Western and Norfolk Southern.
A Rural Hall or North Wilkesboro search might narrow it down.  I do know there are photos of the Southern’s last
passenger train to North Wilkesboro.

James Wall
Rural Hall, NC




locked Southern passenger cars on Winston-Salem division mixed trains

A&Y Dave in MD
 

I was doing some data analysis on Conductor Snow's log books from 1934 today and noticed that there were three passenger car "types" routinely on mixed trains 13/14 on the North Wilkesboro branch.  Conductor Snow identified them as a mail (Southern 71),  express (Southern 373) and one of two coaches (either 1520 or 1523).   These were listed as the last cars on the train (there was a caboose listed as 1st in order in his books, but that may be because it was assigned to the train first and may not reflect position in the train).

Anyone have any info/photos about these mail, express, and coach cars?

I'm hoping to use these to write up a story on the Winston-Salem division mixed trains with a little background on the North Wilkesboro line for a TIES article.  These mixed trains were usually about 29 cars pulled by consolidations (either Ks 812 or Ks 654 for most).  On the way to N. Wilkesboro they had mostly (60% boxcars with merchandise, feed, lumber, sugar,  flour, fertilizer, and hides) , and usually with a gondola of coal and a tank of gasoline. Occasionally they would see a reefer of meat from Schluderburg-Kurdle out of Baltimore (often marketed as Esskay meats).  On the way back, the boxcars were more often empties, but those with loads carried furniture and merchandise, often waybilled to Spencer or Potomac yard.  There seemed to be a regular set of 36' SU box cars that were LCL merchandise regulars.  On these trains about 70% of the boxcars were home road Southern with N&W (10%) and ACL (5%).  The tank cars with gasoline were mostly UTLX and Texaco (TCX), although there were a fair number of INSX (International Shoe via GATX) waybilled to North Wilkesboro empty (for leather dye loading?).

But I don't know much about the passenger equipment from 1934.  So any help would be appreciated.

Dave Bott


--

Sent from David Bott's desktop pc


locked Re: G A Jones

Dave Roberts <daveroberts10@...>
 

Thanks for the reply. Have a few records on some time card books and a Southern family pass but
that seems to be all that remains of my grandfather’s Southern History.

On Nov 22, 2020, at 12:19 PM, Carl Ardrey <carlardrey2005@comcast.net> wrote:

SRHA doesn't have any personnel records. Those records, personnel and operational, were all held at the division level and are long gone.
CEA
On 11/22/2020 10:46 AM Dave Roberts <daveroberts10@charter.net> wrote:


Looking for any information related to G A (George Arthur) Jones - Asheville Division - Freight Agent - Office in Flat Iron Building downtown Asheville - Long time Southern employee retired in the 1960s. Thanks.






locked Re: G A Jones

Carl Ardrey
 

SRHA doesn't have any personnel records. Those records, personnel and operational, were all held at the division level and are long gone.
CEA

On 11/22/2020 10:46 AM Dave Roberts <daveroberts10@charter.net> wrote:


Looking for any information related to G A (George Arthur) Jones - Asheville Division - Freight Agent - Office in Flat Iron Building downtown Asheville - Long time Southern employee retired in the 1960s. Thanks.



locked G A Jones

daveroberts10@...
 

Looking for any information related to G A (George Arthur) Jones - Asheville Division - Freight Agent - Office in Flat Iron Building downtown Asheville - Long time Southern employee retired in the 1960s. Thanks.


locked Southern Railway 1982 Freight Car diagrams

Scott Reinert <srlinesrr@...>
 

I am looking for the 1982 Southern Railway Frieght Car Diagrams. There used to be a site online that had it as a free pdf, as well as other equipment documents, timetables, a bunch of Bob Harpe? Clinics on model SOU Diesels. If anyone has this document or anything like it that they would share, I would be greatly appreciative. We here at Oso Machining's Rail division are looking into making such cars as the Silversides, Magor Covered Hoppers 2, 3, and 4-bay varieties, the 60' 100ton PS box cars, among others.

Scott Reinert
srlinesrr@...
Oso Machining Rail Division


locked Re: Via Sleeping Car NYC to San Francisco via Atlanta-Montgomery-New Orleans!

Robert Hanson
 

Ike, et al - 

The Pullman Company's  Schedule of Lines dated July 15, 1915, shows a Washington-San Francisco tourist sleeper, line No. 2640 1/2(!) but it was not handled in No. 38, but rather was handled in SOU 29, WPR 39. L&N 3, and SP 101.

Mileage - 3,616.

Bob Hanson
Loganville, GA


-----Original Message-----
From: George Eichelberger <geichelberger@...>
To: main@southernrailway.groups.io <main@SouthernRailway.groups.io>; PassengerCarList@groups.io
Sent: Sat, Nov 21, 2020 7:30 pm
Subject: [SouthernRailway] Via Sleeping Car NYC to San Francisco via Atlanta-Montgomery-New Orleans!

From the SRHA archives:

The attached letter from the L&N to Southern dated Nov 2, 1914 discusses the handling of a tourist sleeping car to San Francisco. Research in “Guides” and PTTs could confirm the route. Assuming it went through Washington to NYC, could this the longest Pullman line in the US?

Ike


locked Re: Via Sleeping Car NYC to San Francisco via Atlanta-Montgomery-New Orleans!

Jason Greene
 

Now that is interesting that they can put the car on whatever train they want. Seems like it would need to keep a schedule. Would you get a ticket to arrive on a specific date and not time?
Also, what route from N.O. I wonder? SP to LA then north or dropped somewhere earlier and moved north before LA. 

Jason Greene 

On Nov 21, 2020, at 7:31 PM, George Eichelberger <geichelberger@...> wrote:

From the SRHA archives:

The attached letter from the L&N to Southern dated Nov 2, 1914 discusses the handling of a tourist sleeping car to San Francisco. Research in “Guides” and PTTs could confirm the route. Assuming it went through Washington to NYC, could this the longest Pullman line in the US?

Ike

<1914-11-2 L&N Tr 2 San Francisco tourist car.jpeg>


locked Via Sleeping Car NYC to San Francisco via Atlanta-Montgomery-New Orleans!

George Eichelberger
 

From the SRHA archives:

The attached letter from the L&N to Southern dated Nov 2, 1914 discusses the handling of a tourist sleeping car to San Francisco. Research in “Guides” and PTTs could confirm the route. Assuming it went through Washington to NYC, could this the longest Pullman line in the US?

Ike


locked 1930-35 era lettering for low side gon?

A&Y Dave in MD
 

I have builder's photos from 1924, but that was before the 1928 lettering changes recommended by American Railway Association.  And then there was further changes recommended by the AAR when it was formed in '34.

I have lots of photos of the 1937-1943 rebuilds, but can find no information or photos of 1930 era lettering.

Other than volunteering at the SRHA archives, is there any information available on the lettering (either photos or lettering diagrams) that are specific to the period from 1930-1935?

I've been through all my books and photos and the best I can find is the Duke University construction images from 1929-1930 which show the early pre-1928 scheme and the Southern Railway Handbook's 1924 builders photo.   I can find absolutely nothing from then to 1937, when there are rebuild photos (although mostly dated from 1943-1956).

I'd like to backdate at least two of my Speedwitch media kits to 1934.  I've already developed the artwork for the lettering on the 1929 photos.  I'd like to have one in what I believe is a simplified scheme (at least that's what I see with boxcars and vents).  Can someone confirm that the 1943 scheme would have been identical to that of the early 30's or share an early 30's photo or lettering diagram?

Dave Bott

Attached is an example of my 1928 scheme artwork (although the actual vector artwork is in Adobe Illustrator).


--

Sent from David Bott's desktop pc


locked Re: Sleeping Var Passengers out of Washington week of Jan 7, 1915

C J Wyatt
 

We weren't in the Great War yet, but we were coming out of a recession which lasted from January 1913 until December 1914.

Jack Wyatt

On Friday, November 20, 2020, 06:27:37 PM EST, Edwin Locklin <elocklin@...> wrote:


Ike,
 
Could World War 1 have had any affect on ridership?  WW1 took place from early 1914 towards the end of 1918 which cover these notices on ridership.  My two cents.
 
Ed Locklin at mp367.
 

 
From: George Eichelberger
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 1:28 PM
To: PassengerCarList@groups.io
Cc: main@southernrailway.groups.io
Subject: [SouthernRailway] Sleeping Var Passengers out of Washington week of Jan 7, 1915
 
I posted the attached to the SouthernRailway.io group yesterday and added the Dec 11, 1914 memo today. Other than business being down, it appears the PRR was demanding an increased share of the Pullman fares on trains through Washington. Obviously, more research is needed…is any one aware of what the issue was….circa 1914?
 
Ike
 
 
Begin forwarded message:
 
From: george eichelberger <geichelberger@...>
Subject: Sleeping Var Passengers out of Washington week of Jan 7, 1915
Date: November 19, 2020 at 1:06:04 PM EST
To: "main@southernrailway.groups.io" <main@SouthernRailway.groups.io>
 
From the SRHA Archives:
 
Southern Railway passenger traffic was down in 1915. Washington headquarters asked for almost continuous reports on Pullman passengers, usually to determine if lines should be discontinued. Although a comprehensive list of Pullman Line Numbers on the Southern has never been located in the Presidents’ or Mechanical Dept. files, the summaries sent to Washington give a good sense of how many different lines operated between various city pairs. In this example, trains out of Washington, DC.
 
Ike
 
 
 


locked Re: Sleeping Var Passengers out of Washington week of Jan 7, 1915

Carl Ardrey
 

January 1915 would have been over two years before USA's entry into WWI.

On 11/20/2020 2:21 PM Edwin Locklin <elocklin@...> wrote:
 
 
Ike,
 
Could World War 1 have had any affect on ridership?  WW1 took place from early 1914 towards the end of 1918 which cover these notices on ridership.  My two cents.
 
Ed Locklin at mp367.
 

 
From: George Eichelberger
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 1:28 PM
To: PassengerCarList@groups.io
Cc: main@southernrailway.groups.io
Subject: [SouthernRailway] Sleeping Var Passengers out of Washington week of Jan 7, 1915
 
I posted the attached to the SouthernRailway.io group yesterday and added the Dec 11, 1914 memo today. Other than business being down, it appears the PRR was demanding an increased share of the Pullman fares on trains through Washington. Obviously, more research is needed…is any one aware of what the issue was….circa 1914?
 
Ike
 
 
Begin forwarded message:
 
From: george eichelberger <geichelberger@...>
Subject: Sleeping Var Passengers out of Washington week of Jan 7, 1915
Date: November 19, 2020 at 1:06:04 PM EST
To: "main@southernrailway.groups.io" <main@SouthernRailway.groups.io>
 
From the SRHA Archives:
 
Southern Railway passenger traffic was down in 1915. Washington headquarters asked for almost continuous reports on Pullman passengers, usually to determine if lines should be discontinued. Although a comprehensive list of Pullman Line Numbers on the Southern has never been located in the Presidents’ or Mechanical Dept. files, the summaries sent to Washington give a good sense of how many different lines operated between various city pairs. In this example, trains out of Washington, DC.
 
Ike
 
 
 


locked Re: Sleeping Var Passengers out of Washington week of Jan 7, 1915

 

Ike,
 
Could World War 1 have had any affect on ridership?  WW1 took place from early 1914 towards the end of 1918 which cover these notices on ridership.  My two cents.
 
Ed Locklin at mp367.
 

 

From: George Eichelberger
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 1:28 PM
To: PassengerCarList@groups.io
Cc: main@southernrailway.groups.io
Subject: [SouthernRailway] Sleeping Var Passengers out of Washington week of Jan 7, 1915
 
I posted the attached to the SouthernRailway.io group yesterday and added the Dec 11, 1914 memo today. Other than business being down, it appears the PRR was demanding an increased share of the Pullman fares on trains through Washington. Obviously, more research is needed…is any one aware of what the issue was….circa 1914?
 
Ike
 
 
Begin forwarded message:
 
From: george eichelberger <geichelberger@...>
Subject: Sleeping Var Passengers out of Washington week of Jan 7, 1915
Date: November 19, 2020 at 1:06:04 PM EST
To: "main@southernrailway.groups.io" <main@SouthernRailway.groups.io>
 
From the SRHA Archives:
 
Southern Railway passenger traffic was down in 1915. Washington headquarters asked for almost continuous reports on Pullman passengers, usually to determine if lines should be discontinued. Although a comprehensive list of Pullman Line Numbers on the Southern has never been located in the Presidents’ or Mechanical Dept. files, the summaries sent to Washington give a good sense of how many different lines operated between various city pairs. In this example, trains out of Washington, DC.
 
Ike
 
 
 


locked Re: Sleeping Var Passengers out of Washington week of Jan 7, 1915

Michael Roderick
 

Ike:

 

I have reached out to one of my PRR friends for that information when I get it I will send you the information.

 

Mike

 

From: main@SouthernRailway.groups.io <main@SouthernRailway.groups.io> On Behalf Of George Eichelberger
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2020 13:28
To: PassengerCarList@groups.io
Cc: main@southernrailway.groups.io
Subject: [SouthernRailway] Sleeping Var Passengers out of Washington week of Jan 7, 1915

 

I posted the attached to the SouthernRailway.io group yesterday and added the Dec 11, 1914 memo today. Other than business being down, it appears the PRR was demanding an increased share of the Pullman fares on trains through Washington. Obviously, more research is needed…is any one aware of what the issue was….circa 1914?

 

Ike

 

 

Begin forwarded message:

 

From: george eichelberger <geichelberger@...>

Subject: Sleeping Var Passengers out of Washington week of Jan 7, 1915

Date: November 19, 2020 at 1:06:04 PM EST

 

From the SRHA Archives:

 

Southern Railway passenger traffic was down in 1915. Washington headquarters asked for almost continuous reports on Pullman passengers, usually to determine if lines should be discontinued. Although a comprehensive list of Pullman Line Numbers on the Southern has never been located in the Presidents’ or Mechanical Dept. files, the summaries sent to Washington give a good sense of how many different lines operated between various city pairs. In this example, trains out of Washington, DC.

 

Ike

 

 

 


locked Sleeping Var Passengers out of Washington week of Jan 7, 1915

George Eichelberger
 

I posted the attached to the SouthernRailway.io group yesterday and added the Dec 11, 1914 memo today. Other than business being down, it appears the PRR was demanding an increased share of the Pullman fares on trains through Washington. Obviously, more research is needed…is any one aware of what the issue was….circa 1914?

Ike


Begin forwarded message:

From: george eichelberger <geichelberger@...>
Subject: Sleeping Var Passengers out of Washington week of Jan 7, 1915
Date: November 19, 2020 at 1:06:04 PM EST

From the SRHA Archives:

Southern Railway passenger traffic was down in 1915. Washington headquarters asked for almost continuous reports on Pullman passengers, usually to determine if lines should be discontinued. Although a comprehensive list of Pullman Line Numbers on the Southern has never been located in the Presidents’ or Mechanical Dept. files, the summaries sent to Washington give a good sense of how many different lines operated between various city pairs. In this example, trains out of Washington, DC.

Ike




locked Sleeping Var Passengers out of Washington week of Jan 7, 1915

George Eichelberger
 

From the SRHA Archives:

Southern Railway passenger traffic was down in 1915. Washington headquarters asked for almost continuous reports on Pullman passengers, usually to determine if lines should be discontinued. Although a comprehensive list of Pullman Line Numbers on the Southern has never been located in the Presidents’ or Mechanical Dept. files, the summaries sent to Washington give a good sense of how many different lines operated between various city pairs. In this example, trains out of Washington, DC.

Ike

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