Date   
moderated TIES Magazine, SRHA's Quarterly Journal

Bill Schafer
 

TIES Magazine is the quarterly journal of the Southern Railway Historical Association. It is nominally 32 pages, with prototype articles, mention of notable restorations of Southern Railway equipment or structures, personality profiles (and obituaries), and many other tidbits pertaining to the Premier Carrier of the South. TIES for the 3rd quarter of 2018 (2018-3) is at the printer and will be mailed in the next week or two. TIES has been published since 1987, first as a bimonthly magazine, and, since 2012, as a quarterly. White River Productions does a professional job laying out the magazine, and they arrange for its printing and distribution.

Here's the cover of the 2018-3 TIES. Spoiler alert: much of the subject matter relates to Winston-Salem, N.C. We will also feature additional articles about the Southern in Winston-Salem in 2018-4 TIES. 

Speaking of 2018-4 TIES, here are some other articles we're planning: Southern's Spring Street office building renovation; restoration of an E8 and a 1970 boxcar; first person account of a close call on a Washington Division local freight; and (if space permits) a retrospective of Southern's 2-10-2s.

We have compiled a table of contents for all TIES since 2012. It's in an Excel spreadsheet, so it's searchable. All back issues are available from SRHA - check our website (www.srha.net) for pricing and shipping. 

We are always looking for Southern Railway-related articles to share with our membership - if you have a story to tell, send it to us. Just be sure to have enough source material to make a good article, and if you have some images to go with it, so much the better. Don't worry if think you can't write - that's what editors are for.

--Bill Schafer, Co-editor, TIES Magazine

moderated 2019 SRHA Calendar

Bill Schafer
 

All:

This is a repost since I think the original was deleted. 

—Bill


SRHA's full-color calendar for 2019 is now available. It consists of 14 images, a Southern Railway map, and extended captions for each image. It's a bargain at $10 plus $3 shipping. Here's the flyer:

moderated October Work Session at new SRHA archives building

George Eichelberger
 

All:

Work on the TVRM/SRHA archives building has progressed a great deal since we put a "photo tour" on the SRHA web site (www.srha.net) in August. If you compare those photos to the two I've attached here, you'll notice a huge difference. The "new" photos are about two weeks old and do not show the completed drop ceiling framework, HVAC, electrical and lighting in place. The crates visible in the photos are a portion of SRHA's "Spacesaver" shelving removed from Kennesaw. The Spacesaver agent for GA and TN will start installing them next Wednesday and will be done by Friday of next week. With the shelves installed, we will be able to unpack more than 1,000 archives boxes of SR Presidents' files, books and Valuation Section field notes. We can continue to work in the "office" area of the building on the Southern and Central of Georgia drawing collection, the photo files and nearly 400,000 microfilm aperture cards, 300,000 in the ACL/SALHS collection covering virtually every (!) CSX predecessor and another 100,000 or so Southern and CofG cards.

The work session is set for Friday Oct 19th and Saturday the 20th. We are in the archives more than two days per month. If anyone would like to help, or just visit the facility any other time, please send an email to archives@... and we'll see what can be arranged.

Ike

moderated Re: 2019 SRHA Calendar

Doug Alexander
 

If you "give" some to Steve, you need to "give" some to me at HTK, too!
Just sayin'.
 
Doug



From: Chris Smith <smittydieseldoc@...>
To: "main@southernrailway.groups.io" <main@southernrailway.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, October 2, 2018 11:10 PM
Subject: Re: [SouthernRailway] 2019 SRHA Calendar

Are you going to give some to Steve for sale in his store?

On Tuesday, October 2, 2018, Bill Schafer <bill4501@...> wrote:
SRHA's full-color calendar for 2019 is now available. It consists of 14 images, a Southern Railway map, and extended captions for each image. It's a bargain at $10 plus $3 shipping. Here's the flyer:


moderated Re: October Work Session at new SRHA archives building

Marv Clemons
 

Good to see it all coming together, George.  I’ll be at the museum the weekend of November 9-11 and hope to take a peek if you or someone with access is around.

 

~ Marv

 

From: main@SouthernRailway.groups.io <main@SouthernRailway.groups.io> On Behalf Of George Eichelberger
Sent: Thursday, October 4, 2018 10:47 AM
To: main@SouthernRailway.groups.io
Subject: [SouthernRailway] October Work Session at new SRHA archives building

 

All:

Work on the TVRM/SRHA archives building has progressed a great deal since we put a "photo tour" on the SRHA web site (www.srha.net) in August. If you compare those photos to the two I've attached here, you'll notice a huge difference. The "new" photos are about two weeks old and do not show the completed drop ceiling framework, HVAC, electrical and lighting in place. The crates visible in the photos are a portion of SRHA's "Spacesaver" shelving removed from Kennesaw. The Spacesaver agent for GA and TN will start installing them next Wednesday and will be done by Friday of next week. With the shelves installed, we will be able to unpack more than 1,000 archives boxes of SR Presidents' files, books and Valuation Section field notes. We can continue to work in the "office" area of the building on the Southern and Central of Georgia drawing collection, the photo files and nearly 400,000 microfilm aperture cards, 300,000 in the ACL/SALHS collection covering virtually every (!) CSX predecessor and another 100,000 or so Southern and CofG cards.

The work session is set for Friday Oct 19th and Saturday the 20th. We are in the archives more than two days per month. If anyone would like to help, or just visit the facility any other time, please send an email to archives@... and we'll see what can be arranged.

Ike


Virus-free. www.avast.com

moderated Southern Railway Contracts and Agreements in the SRHA Archives

George Eichelberger
 

Every trackage rights or joint trackage arrangement, Union Station agreement, crossing or interchange between railroads was documented by a contract or agreement negotiated and signed by the parties. Many use essentially the same "boilerplate" language, with specific details added, multiple times. Terms and conditions for different kinds of agreements became almost standardized. That served to simplify negotiations and give everyone a basic understanding of what an agreement included. Many of the points included in the trackage rights agreement between the NC&StL, the Memphis and Charleston and the East Tennessee and Georgia dated October 1, 1880 can be found in agreements negotiated many years later. In fact, many of the the Main and Supplemental agreement conditions contained in Southern Railway contract file No.9 are still in effect between Norfolk Southern and CSX between Stevenson, AL and Wauhatchie, TN today. (NC&StL trackage was used from Wauhatchie to Chattanooga by both the M&C and what became the AGS until the Southern built its own line, through the Lookout Mtn. tunnel.) Reading past the boilerplate we find very specific details about what is covered.

The second example in the Google Drive file illustrates the kinds of maps or drawings attached to some agreements. It is from a 1948 agreement between the Southern and the NC&StL for Howell Jct in Atlanta. Here, the details are all important; which railroad was responsible for every signal, crossing and turnout, which controlled the crossing, etc. Howell i particularly interesting because of its complexity and that there were individual agreements covering the NC&StL (W&A), Seaboard and Southern. The agreement pages were scanned in bound books so they are not "pretty" but include the entire agreement. The Howell Jct. drawing was a fold out attachment that was unbound to make a high quality copy that could be published if someone wrote a "TIES" or L&NHS magazine article on the subject.

Although only a small number of agreements have been scanned completely, the SRHA archives contain approximately 1,203 different examples. The Southern accumulated and bound contracts in books that were distributed to officials through the system. When each of twenty-six (known?) books were produced, a cumulative index was added that included every agreement in force at that time. When contracts expired or were cancelled, they were omitted from the index. The index from Volume XXII issued September 1, 1945 is the third document in the Google Drive file and provides an idea of the scope of the collection. (The first number in an entry is the volume that includes the agreement, the second number is the contract number.)

Scanning contracts and attachments is an on-going task for archives volunteers.

Ike

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1B-S_UsKX7JpYfl7acZZ2Zrl1_b8Mmjnw?usp=sharing

moderated Re: Southern Railway Contracts and Agreements in the SRHA Archives

A&Y Dave in MD
 

Ike,

A good restoration librarian can unbind a bound book so it can be scanned flat and then rebound in the original manner, preserving the original and improving the digital edition. My friend at the Michigan State University archive helped with the CF&YV 1892 Prospectus that Matt Bumgarner had reproduced.

You might see if you can get someone at UT Chattanooga or other nearby archive library to see if a deal could be struck.

Dave

Sent from Dave Bott' iPhone

On Oct 5, 2018, at 6:06 PM, George Eichelberger <geichelberger@...> wrote:

Every trackage rights or joint trackage arrangement, Union Station agreement, crossing or interchange between railroads was documented by a contract or agreement negotiated and signed by the parties. Many use essentially the same "boilerplate" language, with specific details added, multiple times. Terms and conditions for different kinds of agreements became almost standardized. That served to simplify negotiations and give everyone a basic understanding of what an agreement included. Many of the points included in the trackage rights agreement between the NC&StL, the Memphis and Charleston and the East Tennessee and Georgia dated October 1, 1880 can be found in agreements negotiated many years later. In fact, many of the the Main and Supplemental agreement conditions contained in Southern Railway contract file No.9 are still in effect between Norfolk Southern and CSX between Stevenson, AL and Wauhatchie, TN today. (NC&StL trackage was used from Wauhatchie to Chattanooga by both the M&C and what became the AGS until the Southern built its own line, through the Lookout Mtn. tunnel.) Reading past the boilerplate we find very specific details about what is covered.

The second example in the Google Drive file illustrates the kinds of maps or drawings attached to some agreements. It is from a 1948 agreement between the Southern and the NC&StL for Howell Jct in Atlanta. Here, the details are all important; which railroad was responsible for every signal, crossing and turnout, which controlled the crossing, etc. Howell i particularly interesting because of its complexity and that there were individual agreements covering the NC&StL (W&A), Seaboard and Southern. The agreement pages were scanned in bound books so they are not "pretty" but include the entire agreement. The Howell Jct. drawing was a fold out attachment that was unbound to make a high quality copy that could be published if someone wrote a "TIES" or L&NHS magazine article on the subject.

Although only a small number of agreements have been scanned completely, the SRHA archives contain approximately 1,203 different examples. The Southern accumulated and bound contracts in books that were distributed to officials through the system. When each of twenty-six (known?) books were produced, a cumulative index was added that included every agreement in force at that time. When contracts expired or were cancelled, they were omitted from the index. The index from Volume XXII issued September 1, 1945 is the third document in the Google Drive file and provides an idea of the scope of the collection. (The first number in an entry is the volume that includes the agreement, the second number is the contract number.)

Scanning contracts and attachments is an on-going task for archives volunteers.

Ike

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1B-S_UsKX7JpYfl7acZZ2Zrl1_b8Mmjnw?usp=sharing

moderated Re: Southern Railway Contracts and Agreements in the SRHA Archives

George Eichelberger
 

Dave:

Thanks for you comments…..

One set of bound contracts came from the GA Div office in Atlanta. It sat in a bookcase, apparently unused, for years wth direct sunlight on the bindings. The silk thread used in the binding were in good shape but most of the spines were too far gone to save. Although the NC&StL contract in my example was in a bound book, most of the other volumes have been unbound. The fact that bindings were in such poor shape (in many cases) plus the impossibility of scanning their attachments made unbinding them a logical decision.)

Some will certainly disagree but our approach with the SRHA archives materials has been to organize and preserve it to be used, rather than be kept as artifacts. We recently acquired a second set of the contract books and know of a third so the decision to unbind one set was not difficult. By making a full set of scans (a big job with 1,200 agreements), copies can be sent to people doing research without having to go to Chattanooga.

One overriding issue is the fact that people that worked for, or knew, the Southern are aging. If our archives materials are not made use of in the next ten or so years, we will have a marvelous pile of paper that few people will care about.

Because we have the entire Southern Railway President’s files, there are many cases where we have both the printed contracts AND the Executive Dept files that led up to those agreements. They contain draft agreements, correspondence and internal memos on the subject. When research combines those assets with photos and drawings in the collection, we can describe important events in the history of the Southern in ways we never expected. I suggest finding a copy of TIES with the article on the collapse of the Tennessee River Bridge in Chattanooga as an example.

Ike



On Oct 5, 2018, at 9:19 PM, A&Y Dave in MD <dbott@...> wrote:

Ike,

A good restoration librarian can unbind a bound book so it can be scanned flat and then rebound in the original manner, preserving the original and improving the digital edition. My friend at the Michigan State University archive helped with the CF&YV 1892 Prospectus that Matt Bumgarner had reproduced.

You might see if you can get someone at UT Chattanooga or other nearby archive library to see if a deal could be struck.

Dave

Sent from Dave Bott' iPhone

On Oct 5, 2018, at 6:06 PM, George Eichelberger <geichelberger@...> wrote:

Every trackage rights or joint trackage arrangement, Union Station agreement, crossing or interchange between railroads was documented by a contract or agreement negotiated and signed by the parties. Many use essentially the same "boilerplate" language, with specific details added, multiple times. Terms and conditions for different kinds of agreements became almost standardized. That served to simplify negotiations and give everyone a basic understanding of what an agreement included. Many of the points included in the trackage rights agreement between the NC&StL, the Memphis and Charleston and the East Tennessee and Georgia dated October 1, 1880 can be found in agreements negotiated many years later. In fact, many of the the Main and Supplemental agreement conditions contained in Southern Railway contract file No.9 are still in effect between Norfolk Southern and CSX between Stevenson, AL and Wauhatchie, TN today. (NC&StL trackage was used from Wauhatchie to Chattanooga by both the M&C and what became the AGS until the Southern built its own line, through the Lookout Mtn. tunnel.) Reading past the boilerplate we find very specific details about what is covered.

The second example in the Google Drive file illustrates the kinds of maps or drawings attached to some agreements. It is from a 1948 agreement between the Southern and the NC&StL for Howell Jct in Atlanta. Here, the details are all important; which railroad was responsible for every signal, crossing and turnout, which controlled the crossing, etc. Howell i particularly interesting because of its complexity and that there were individual agreements covering the NC&StL (W&A), Seaboard and Southern. The agreement pages were scanned in bound books so they are not "pretty" but include the entire agreement. The Howell Jct. drawing was a fold out attachment that was unbound to make a high quality copy that could be published if someone wrote a "TIES" or L&NHS magazine article on the subject.

Although only a small number of agreements have been scanned completely, the SRHA archives contain approximately 1,203 different examples. The Southern accumulated and bound contracts in books that were distributed to officials through the system. When each of twenty-six (known?) books were produced, a cumulative index was added that included every agreement in force at that time. When contracts expired or were cancelled, they were omitted from the index. The index from Volume XXII issued September 1, 1945 is the third document in the Google Drive file and provides an idea of the scope of the collection. (The first number in an entry is the volume that includes the agreement, the second number is the contract number.)

Scanning contracts and attachments is an on-going task for archives volunteers.

Ike

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1B-S_UsKX7JpYfl7acZZ2Zrl1_b8Mmjnw?usp=sharing

moderated Re: Southern Railway Contracts and Agreements in the SRHA Archives

Jason Greene
 

Any chance Vol. 4 Contract 263 has been scanned? I would like to see if it might fill a gap in the history that I have been working on for the Sloss Sheffield/US Pipe railroad history. It is fairly complete but there are a few gaps still.

Jason Greene

moderated Re: Southern Railway Contracts and Agreements in the SRHA Archives

Jason Greene
 

6-361 would also be of interest for the history I mentioned before.

Jason Greene

moderated Re: Southern Railway Contracts and Agreements in the SRHA Archives

George Eichelberger
 

Jason:

Good to hear from you…

Sorry, I don’t see “361” in the scanned files. It may be simply because we have not got to it yet. What is it about?

I know you are interested in the BIrmingham area. It may be the largest number of contracts of any specific area. The trackage rights agreements around B’ham, plus the Terminal Station agreements, street trackage, etc. all need to be researched and written up in TIES.

Ike

On Oct 5, 2018, at 10:11 PM, Jason Greene <jason.p.greene@...> wrote:

6-361 would also be of interest for the history I mentioned before.

Jason Greene

moderated Re: Southern Railway Contracts and Agreements in the SRHA Archives

George Eichelberger
 

Jason:

Sorry no again! There is a “hole” in the scaned files from 245 to 268. That may be a book we do not have or have not worked on yet. The second set of bound contracts may have books that were missing from the first set. We are now at the point where we will be able to locate and organize everything in our archives in the next month or so.

As you may recognize, while we have many projects to do, the SR Contracts files need some attention.

Ike



On Oct 5, 2018, at 10:08 PM, Jason Greene <jason.p.greene@...> wrote:

Any chance Vol. 4 Contract 263 has been scanned? I would like to see if it might fill a gap in the history that I have been working on for the Sloss Sheffield/US Pipe railroad history. It is fairly complete but there are a few gaps still.

Jason Greene

moderated Re: Southern Railway Contracts and Agreements in the SRHA Archives

A&Y Dave in MD
 

Ike,

That's good news on the bindings.  I agree on the idea of getting the stuff to people who understand and know it while they are alive!  Good priorities.  I truly wished I lived closer to help!

I can tell you I wish I could chat with the survey engineers who did the ICC valuation in 1916-1918 on the A&Y!  Much of it is legible (100 year old pencil on graph paper digitally imaged with 2nd generation Nikon CoolPix 950 digital camera in 2000), but there are terms and some notations that I would dearly love to understand better.  Modern engineers have not been able to help.  I have not been able to clean up the images enough to put them on the web and ask others.  But I've already lost the battle with time. So there's no hurry and I might get back to the Archives one day with an LED flatbed scanner (they let me use a handheld one last time I was there, but it was worse than digital camera image and a LOT slower).  Then I can get much better images of the reports.  Maybe then I can learn more.

Good luck with your race against time!

Dave

Friday, October 5, 2018, 10:19:46 PM, you wrote:


Dave:

Thanks for you comments…..

One set of bound contracts came from the GA Div office in Atlanta. It sat in a bookcase, apparently unused, for years wth direct sunlight on the bindings. The silk thread used in the binding were in good shape but most of the spines were too far gone to save. Although the NC&StL contract in my example was in a bound book, most of the other volumes have been unbound. The fact that bindings were in such poor shape (in many cases) plus the impossibility of scanning their attachments made unbinding them a logical decision.)

Some will certainly disagree but our approach with the SRHA archives materials has been to organize and preserve it to be used, rather than be kept as artifacts. We recently acquired a second set of the contract books and know of a third so the decision to unbind one set was not difficult. By making a full set of scans (a big job with 1,200 agreements), copies can be sent to people doing research without having to go to Chattanooga.

One overriding issue is the fact that people that worked for, or knew, the Southern are aging. If our archives materials are not made use of in the next ten or so years, we will have a marvelous pile of paper that few people will care about.

Because we have the entire Southern Railway President’s files, there are many cases where we have both the printed contracts AND the Executive Dept files that led up to those agreements. They contain draft agreements, correspondence and internal memos on the subject. When research combines those assets with photos and drawings in the collection, we can describe important events in the history of the Southern in ways we never expected. I suggest finding a copy of TIES with the article on the collapse of the Tennessee River Bridge in Chattanooga as an example.

Ike



On Oct 5, 2018, at 9:19 PM, A&Y Dave in MD <dbott@...> wrote:

Ike,

A good restoration librarian can unbind a bound book so it can be scanned flat and then rebound in the original manner, preserving the original and improving the digital edition. My friend at the Michigan State University archive helped with the CF&YV 1892 Prospectus that Matt Bumgarner had reproduced.

You might see if you can get someone at UT Chattanooga or other nearby archive library to see if a deal could be struck.

Dave

Sent from Dave Bott' iPhone

On Oct 5, 2018, at 6:06 PM, George Eichelberger <
geichelberger@...> wrote:


Every trackage rights or joint trackage arrangement, Union Station agreement, crossing or interchange between railroads was documented by a contract or agreement negotiated and signed by the parties. Many use essentially the same "boilerplate" language, with specific details added, multiple times. Terms and conditions for different kinds of agreements became almost standardized. That served to simplify negotiations and give everyone a basic understanding of what an agreement included. Many of the points included in the trackage rights agreement between the NC&StL, the Memphis and Charleston and the East Tennessee and Georgia dated October 1, 1880 can be found in agreements negotiated many years later. In fact, many of the the Main and Supplemental agreement conditions contained in Southern Railway contract file No.9 are still in effect between Norfolk Southern and CSX between Stevenson, AL and Wauhatchie, TN today. (NC&StL trackage was used from Wauhatchie to Chattanooga by both the M&C and what became the AGS until the Southern built its own line, through the Lookout Mtn. tunnel.) Reading past the boilerplate we find very specific details about what is covered.

The second example in the Google Drive file illustrates the kinds of maps or drawings attached to some agreements. It is from a 1948 agreement between the Southern and the NC&StL for Howell Jct in Atlanta. Here, the details are all important; which railroad was responsible for every signal, crossing and turnout, which controlled the crossing, etc. Howell i particularly interesting because of its complexity and that there were individual agreements covering the NC&StL (W&A), Seaboard and Southern. The agreement pages were scanned in bound books so they are not "pretty" but include the entire agreement. The Howell Jct. drawing was a fold out attachment that was unbound to make a high quality copy that could be published if someone wrote a "TIES" or L&NHS magazine article on the subject.

Although only a small number of agreements have been scanned completely, the SRHA archives contain approximately 1,203 different examples. The Southern accumulated and bound contracts in books that were distributed to officials through the system. When each of twenty-six (known?) books were produced, a cumulative index was added that included every agreement in force at that time. When contracts expired or were cancelled, they were omitted from the index. The index from Volume XXII issued September 1, 1945 is the third document in the Google Drive file and provides an idea of the scope of the collection. (The first number in an entry is the volume that includes the agreement, the second number is the contract number.)

Scanning contracts and attachments is an on-going task for archives volunteers.

Ike

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1B-S_UsKX7JpYfl7acZZ2Zrl1_b8Mmjnw?usp=sharing



--
David Bott

Sent from David Bott's desktop PC

moderated Whatever happened to SOU 390399?

Bill Schafer
 

We received an interesting question on the SRHA Facebook page: does anyone know what happened to SOU 390300, an Ortner rapid-discharge hopper? It was painted in a one-of-a-kind paint scheme for a little while. See attachment. What prompted this question was the recent restoration, by the North Carolina Transportation Museum, of SOU 550555, a 50' boxcar built in 1970, that was the 200,000th car outshopped by Pullman-Standard's Bessemer (Ala.) Works. 550555 was also painted in a unique scheme that lasted for at least a decade; this car's history will be featured in 2018-4 TIES, which, hopefully, will be mailed to SRHA members between Thanksgiving and Christmas.

moderated Re: Whatever happened to SOU 390399?

mclemons@...
 

Bill, I’ve just listed on Ebay a slide of SOU 550555 taken the month the car was released by Pullman-Standard.  It’s probably too late to be used with your article, but let me know if you need a scan for your file. You can view it on Ebay under my ID “birminghamrails”.

 

Best regards,

Marv

 

From: main@SouthernRailway.groups.io <main@SouthernRailway.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill Schafer
Sent: Saturday, October 6, 2018 10:40 AM
To: main@SouthernRailway.groups.io
Subject: [SouthernRailway] Whatever happened to SOU 390399?

 

We received an interesting question on the SRHA Facebook page: does anyone know what happened to SOU 390300, an Ortner rapid-discharge hopper? It was painted in a one-of-a-kind paint scheme for a little while. See attachment. What prompted this question was the recent restoration, by the North Carolina Transportation Museum, of SOU 550555, a 50' boxcar built in 1970, that was the 200,000th car outshopped by Pullman-Standard's Bessemer (Ala.) Works. 550555 was also painted in a unique scheme that lasted for at least a decade; this car's history will be featured in 2018-4 TIES, which, hopefully, will be mailed to SRHA members between Thanksgiving and Christmas.


Virus-free. www.avast.com

moderated ICC Valuation Rolling Stock Information in the SRHA Archives

George Eichelberger
 

There are simply too many pages in the ICC rolling stock accounts to put on line so I have copied a sample of what is in the SRHA archives. The Google Drive link is:
 

Items 1, 2 and 3 are pages covering the period from 7/1/16 to 12/31/2 when the railroads were to complete their inventory and valuation of virtually everything they owned. Using a 1916 “base” date, Form 1742 was used to deduct or add investment in each “group” of equipment to develop a complete investment inventory by 12/31/1927. Item 1 shows the “Additions and Betterments” that modified the investment in VO#3 (Valuation Order #3), Group 100 cars up tp the end of 1927. Rolling stock was grouped by physical characteristics rather than road numbers, carbuilders or when the equipment was acquired or converted.
 
Item 3 is a partial list of 1,501 cars in the group. Although all were “Plain Box Cars, Wood Body, steel center sills (SCS) 36’ 10” in length with 60,000 capy”, road numbers from 10501 to 134265 indicate they came from multiple car orders. To understand the details of any of these cars, it is necessary to go to the various renumbering programs that took place before the ICC Valuation study began.
 
As the Southern acquired or took full control of the CNO&TP, AGS, NO&NE, etc. their rosters were renumbered and combined into a unified system. The cars listed on Item 3 came from different predecessor railroads. As all box cars in a Group shared dimensions and capacity, the unique feature of “Group 100” cars were their steel center sills (SCS). The “renewing” shown for 2,145 cars in 1923 and 24 likely added “SCS” to most of them. (There were also “steel underframe” (SUF) and “wood underframe” (WUF) cars in 1927 but they are found in other valuation groups.)
 
While the SRHA archives contain most of those renumbering records (Item 12) the drawings, specifications and correspondence for the predecessor railroads apparently never made it to the Southern’s files. With only a few R&D exceptions, rolling stock drawings in the SRHA archives begin with the first orders of cars by the Southern Railway about 1904.
 
Items 4 though 11 also use Form 1742 to show “As and Bs” and retirements after the initial Valuation study. On June 30 and December 31 of every year, all railroads submitted 1742s to keep their valuation information up to date.
 
Items 4 and 5 record changes to Account 51 “Steam Locomotives” that occurred in the second six months of 1925. As with freight cars, locos were grouped together by type and service. Items 6 and 7 are for Account 53 “Freight Cars”, items 8 and 9 are from Account 54 “Passenger Cars”. Items 1-8 are from the Dec 31, 1925 forms 1742 sent to the ICC, items 9 and 10 are fro the period ending June 30, 1937. All of these example are from the CNO&TP. The Southern, and subsidiary roads submitted their own Forms 1742 until the ICC stopped requiring them in printed form (in the late 1960s?)
 
Although not shown in these examples, there was an Account 50 for “Other” (electric, gas-electric, etc.) locomotives. It was not until the 1950s, that “Other” was changed to Diesels.
 
Equipment was typically removed from the accounts as “Retired Condemned” or “Retired Destroyed. Once in a great while “Retired - Not Located” appears when a car could simply not be found to retire. (Notes mention the car had gone into Mexico and not been returned.) Cars were also moved between accounts, accounts 53 and 54 to Account 57 “Work Equipment”. Item 10 shows boarding cars converted from box cars and moved in the accounts.
 
Thousands of entries from 1742 forms have been transcribed to spreadsheets, If volunteers can help complete and “QC” the spreadsheets, they could be published to provide the most compete history possible of ALL Southern Railway rolling stock.
 
Ike

moderated SRHA Archives Work Sessions

Jim Thurston
 

The SRHA Archives Work Session schedule has been set through 2019, beginning with Oct 19-20 (Fri-Sat) this month.

These dates, along with any changes, will also be posted here and on our website: SRHA.net

Generally these sessions will be Friday-Saturday on the weekend of the third Sat each month, but there are exceptions to avoid holidays and conflicts.

If you want to come and work (or visit) at other times, please let me know by email and this can usually be arranged.

Jim Thurston

jthurston@...


2018 Work Sessions

October 19-20
November 16-17
December 14-15

2019 Work Sessions

January 25-26
February 22-23
March 15-16
April 26-27
May 17-18
June 21-22
July 19-20
August 16-17
September 20-21
October 18-19
November 15-16
December 13-14


moderated Central of Georgia freight routing

George Eichelberger
 

Yesterday at the SRHA archives, I scanned a file that included a letter from Mr. W.E. Dillard, President of the Central of Georgia Railroad to Mr. D.W. Brosnan, President of the Southern dated August 28, 1963, two months after the Southern took over the CofG, a difficult time for the Central. Mr. Dillard sent the note with an attachment describing the CG Marketing people had worked with their customers to include or change the routing of 670 cars.

While the “my sincere” note from “DWB”, appears unusually soft compared to other correspondence, the attachment is interesting because of its detail showing both inbound and outbound customers, what they shipped, origins and destinations and their routes.

The Google Drive link to the letter and attachments is:


Ike

PS Work to modify the new archives building at TVRM is virtually complete. We will be unpacking and shelving the Southern Railway Presidents’ and Mechanical Dept files along with other projects at the Oct 19 and 20 work session. Join us if you can! For additional information, please contact archives@....

moderated Re: Central of Georgia freight routing

Tim
 

Ike;

Thank you again for putting all of these little gems someplace where we can get at them. ;)

Tim Rumph
Lancaster, SC

moderated Southern's Arrow Logo?

George Eichelberger
 

All:

Here is an interesting series of emails about the Southern’s “Arrow” monogram (I have never seen the word “logo” in company documentation.)

Can anyone provide any additional information?

Ike

PS There are many letterheads in the SRHA archives. Many are on letterheads never used. They were kept, turned over and the reverse side used after the letterhead was obsolete. Some of the letterheads from car builders and customers are literally works of art that take up 1/3 of the page.


Begin forwarded message:

From: Bill Schafer <bill4501@...>
Subject: Re: Southern's Arrow Logo?
Date: October 15, 2018 at 12:22:04 PM EDT


All:

I have Official Guides from 1889 and from 1893. Sometime between those two dates, railroad monograms and logos seem to have proliferated. The entries in the 1889 Guide are pretty plain for most railroads including the R&D (also including the PRR entry, which does NOT feature the keystone logo) but by 1893, nearly every major railroad had some kind of identifying monogram, trademark, or logo. I don’t have access to my timetables that go back that far, but I’m pretty sure they would show the same thing.

The arrow-through-the-letters logo, originating with the R&D, was definitely the inspiration for the similar SOU trademark. I have not seen any correspondence that discusses this, but the empirical evidence is pretty convincing. Maybe some letterhead or other document in the SRHA Archives can show where the arrow logo was used before 1893.

Early SOU public timetables featured the SR-with-arrow monogram on the cover but subsequent timetables dropped any kind of logo, even (until the 1920s) on the maps. For example, the timetables from 1894 to 1907 have the logo on the cover; the 1909 and subsequent ones, don't. A Southern trademark - the “SR-in-a-circle” - does not reappear to the cover of system public timetables until 1954. 

The Official Guide, however, is different. From at least 1893 on, just about all major railroads had an identifying mark in the outer upper corners of each page of their entry so a station agent, flipping through the pages, could find the railroad he was looking for quickly. From 1894 until at least 1910, the Southern entry used the arrow logo on the outer corners of each page. From 1915 on, they used the SR-in-the-circle monogram. This monogram was designed, invented, and adopted in 1915. The story of how it came to be designed - as a doodle on a napkin - is described in the November-December 1990 issue of SRHA’s The Green Light (predecessor to TIES magazine).

Hope this helps.

—Bill Schafer



On Oct 15, 2018, at 11:33 AM, george eichelberger <geichelberger@...> wrote:

Eric:

The “Arrow” monogram was adapted from an R&D version (see attached). We do not know when the R&D started using it but it’s safe to say the Southern had it in mind on day one. I am aware it was used into the teens and twenties but have never seen anything that ended its use.

Maybe our TIES Editor has some additional info?

Ike


---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: Eric Zabilka
Date: Sat, Oct 13, 2018, 8:56 PM
Subject: Southern's Arrow Logo?
To: <Webmaster@...>


I am a member of the SRHA and have a quick, and probably dumb, question.
Do we know when the Southern started using the SR logo with the arrow behind it?  And was there a point when it stopped using that particular logo?

Eric Zabilka
Wilmore, Kentucky