Date   

locked Re: Samuel Spencer

C J Wyatt
 

Yes, I have been a bit surprised that no one has done a book on Samuel Spencer.

Well we know that he liked quail hunting and he apparently enjoyed hanging around the Jekyll Island Club. Paranormal folklore says that his ghost haunts the place and likes to play tricks on guests such as rearranging things.

I hope someone takes up the project.

Jack Wyatt

On Friday, December 20, 2019, 09:46:13 AM EST, Cohen Bob via Groups.Io <orl96782@...> wrote:


James and all:

As no proper biography exists for Spencer that I have seen, I for one would like to see one, and with it, the answer to your query.

He was obviously a capable person and financially astute and after the B&O evicted him from its presidency after one year where he tried to show where B&O's wonder boy John W. Garrett, had been cooking the books for years, those in control of the B&O stock couldn't handle that and he was cast out after just one year and went into the camp of JP Morgan. Morgan placed him as one of the receivers of the Richmond & Danville RR and became SR's first president in 1894 and remained until he was killed in a rear end accident on his own railroad 10 miles south of Lynchburg in late November 1906.

I, too, have often wondered as to his personality and attitudes, especially towards the B&O. Was he above all that or did he have an inward desire to get back at them/it?

I dunno either. would be nice to see somewhere.

I have heard his papers are somewhere in North Carolina, just waiting for someone to do what we ask here.

Bob Cohen


locked Re: Samuel Spencer

Cohen Bob
 

James and all:

As no proper biography exists for Spencer that I have seen, I for one would like to see one, and with it, the answer to your query.

He was obviously a capable person and financially astute and after the B&O evicted him from its presidency after one year where he tried to show where B&O's wonder boy John W. Garrett, had been cooking the books for years, those in control of the B&O stock couldn't handle that and he was cast out after just one year and went into the camp of JP Morgan. Morgan placed him as one of the receivers of the Richmond & Danville RR and became SR's first president in 1894 and remained until he was killed in a rear end accident on his own railroad 10 miles south of Lynchburg in late November 1906.

I, too, have often wondered as to his personality and attitudes, especially towards the B&O. Was he above all that or did he have an inward desire to get back at them/it?

I dunno either. would be nice to see somewhere.

I have heard his papers are somewhere in North Carolina, just waiting for someone to do what we ask here.

Bob Cohen


locked Virginia's Governor announces Potomac River passenger train bridge replacement

Cohen Bob
 

Okay, so you construct a new, parallel bridge next to the 1904 Long Bridge and then what?

By my understanding, unless you ALSO expand the track infrastructure north of the bridge in concert with said construction, where clearances are tight, not to mention the First Street Tunnel into Union Station, all that has been accomplished is you have moved the choke point about one measly mile north of the Potomac River and the only accomplishment is at Virginia taxpayer's expense.

There are just two tracks north of the bridge into DC and CSX has just recently totally rebuilt its Virginia Avenue freight routing to two tracks, at someone's great expense, not that it has been used by passenger trains regularly since November 1907 (basically only re-routings and excursions), little has been actually accomplished other then fleecing taxpayers and a lot of hopes and wannabe this's, that's and t'other's.

A little very basic history here just for perspective:

The first bridge across the river was built here under President Thomas Jefferson's presidency, was burned by the Federals in 1814 to keep the British from entering DC that way (which they did anyway), rebuilt afterwards and remained a privately owned crossing until damaged by flooding around 1832.

It was rebuilt under government auspices under President Andrew Jackson in 1836-1837 and with various fits and starts, remained until the 1860s and the Civil War necessitated other exigencies.

By that time, it was old and rickety and could NOT support locomotives (although the Union tried without success I am told), and the US MRR built an entirely new parallel bridge 1863-1864 which was reopened in October 1864 and could support locomotives.

The older parallel bridge didn't last much longer but then neither did the just built US M RR bridge.

Under the guidance of Pennsylvania senator Simon Cameron, the bridge ownership was transferred from the government to (cough, cough, ahem !!)  "his" aligned Pennsylvania Railroad in June 1870, which promptly built an entirely new parallel structure replacing the CW built one.

When that new one opened in May 1872, the older one was removed, and with various fits and starts remained until 1907 when it was removed.

However, the next new bridge was built here 1902-1904 and opened August 28, 1904. A little sidelight to history here, the first train to pass across it was a Southern Railway passenger train to Bluemont, Virginia, the line which came under the auspices of the Washington & Old Dominion RR on July 1, 1912.

During World War II, the government recognizing the even then inadequacies of the existing bridge removed the truss spans and replaced them with girders as we see today, also with a new supporting pier between each of the older ones. All spans were replaced at that time EXCEPT the movable portion which still stands today over the channel. During the rebuilding, traffic was maintained, except for brief periods when a single old span was removed and two new ones were simultaneously placed.

Along the way, in 1902 or thereabouts, the PR's corporate structure changed a wee bit as its older PW&B (Philadelphia, Wilmington & Baltimore RR), was "sold" to its PB&W (Philadelphia, Baltimore & Washington) RR and that remained until Penn Central of February 1, 1968, which phased into Conrail in 1976, which then was phased out in 1999 to the present CSXT (Chessie Seaboard Expanded or multiplied) RR, which is where we are today.

In 1870, one of the stipulations by ole Simon Cameron was that the PRR (albeit B&P (Baltimore & Potomac RR or the Alexandria & Washington RR), as a condition of said ownership transfer maintain it in good, operable condition and permit any and all other RR passage across it in perpetuity.

Unless the government is ready to totally nationalize the railroads, (I sincerely doubt that for obvious reasons), the expenses of all this, while wonderful for the traveling public which largely doesn't directly patronize the railroads in passenger service, is a whopper of an expense. The public does of course benefit indirectly from the freight carried every mile of the way.

And 100 or more years ago the people and trust busters, and progressive leadership of the country told us that the likes of JP Morgan, Gould, Fisk, CP Huntington and the Big Four, and many others were evil individuals leading even more evil and bad corporations?

Do you detect a wee touch of cynicism from here?

end of soapbox.


Bob Cohen


locked Re: Southern Rolling Stock

George Eichelberger
 

James:

Are you aware that SRHA has published a three-volume set of SR freight car diagrams plus books on Southern’s 40 and 50 box cars? I suggest you check out the SRHA “Grab” on www.srha.com, TIES magazine also includes articles of Southern rolling stock.

Ike


On Dec 20, 2019, at 6:11 AM, James Walton <whovianwil@...> wrote:

Does anyone know of any published resources for the Southern's rolling stock? The reprint of the 1953 ORER is fine for numbers of freight cars, but very little else.


locked Re: Southern Rolling Stock

Aidrian Bridgeman-Sutton
 

James, 

What are you looking for?  There is no single source foe everything as far as I know, but knowing whether you're looking for paint details, plans or something else might be helpful.

Aidrian 


On Fri, 20 Dec 2019, 11:11 am James Walton, <whovianwil@...> wrote:
Does anyone know of any published resources for the Southern's rolling stock? The reprint of the 1953 ORER is fine for numbers of freight cars, but very little else.


locked Southern Rolling Stock

James Walton
 

Does anyone know of any published resources for the Southern's rolling stock? The reprint of the 1953 ORER is fine for numbers of freight cars, but very little else.


locked Re: Samuel Spencer

James Walton
 

Does anyone know any details regarding Spencer's personality?


On Thu, Dec 19, 2019, 10:34 Robert Hanson via Groups.Io <RHanson669=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Apparently I missed something - are they going to move the statue?

I believe that the statue is sitting right where it should sit - in front of the NS building in Atlanta and if it should be moved at all, it should be moved to the new NS corporate HQ building when it is completed.

My opinion - and my opinion, plus $2.00, will get you a copy of an Atlanta newspaper on any weekday.

Bob Hanson


-----Original Message-----
From: C J Wyatt <cjwyatt@...>
To: main <main@SouthernRailway.groups.io>
Sent: Thu, Dec 19, 2019 10:08 am
Subject: Re: [SouthernRailway] Samuel Spencer

Unfortunately, people are become less likely to judge a historical person by the context of his times. Samuel Spencer was only a teenager at the time seeing his state being invaded by outside forces.

While on the surface, Spencer Shops appears to be the proper place for Samuel, you have to ask where he would he be safe from "the crazies". North Carolina recently allowed the statue of another Confederate soldier named Sam to be pulled down.

I find it sad that the Georgia born Samuel Spencer cannot reside at the NSC headquarters in Georgia. The economic growth in the Southeast which his Southern Railway System facilitated helped to raise the standards of living for all people in the region.

Jack Wyatt

On Thursday, December 19, 2019, 08:45:04 AM EST, George Eichelberger <geichelberger@...> wrote:


I understand there is now a question about what to do with Mr. Spencer’s statue that sits in front of the David Goode building in Atlanta. SRHA members have suggested its proper home is at the shops at Spencer, NC. Although some have mentioned moving it to TVRM, I think the consensus (for what it is worth) is that Spencer is the proper place if not at the NS headquarters.

We have NS President Wick Moorman to thank for making the effort to retrieve the statue from obscurity in Atlanta and moving it to Goode building. In my personal opinion, any railroad or corporation that forgets or ignores its history (NS, in all of its predecessors has as much as anyone) is “pulling the pin” on what has gone before.

(BTW) In the SRHA file on the statue’s dedication, it mentions how SR employees paid for it with deductions from their pay envelopes. The “chits” employees signed for the deductions were sealed in a box below the statue. When the statue’s base was moved, the box was located and opened. Unfortunately, water had entered it long ago and the chits were simply a mass of rotten paper. While the effort failed, it was a fine example of NS wanting to preserve its past.





locked Re: Samuel Spencer

Robert Hanson
 

Apparently I missed something - are they going to move the statue?

I believe that the statue is sitting right where it should sit - in front of the NS building in Atlanta and if it should be moved at all, it should be moved to the new NS corporate HQ building when it is completed.

My opinion - and my opinion, plus $2.00, will get you a copy of an Atlanta newspaper on any weekday.

Bob Hanson


-----Original Message-----
From: C J Wyatt <cjwyatt@...>
To: main <main@SouthernRailway.groups.io>
Sent: Thu, Dec 19, 2019 10:08 am
Subject: Re: [SouthernRailway] Samuel Spencer

Unfortunately, people are become less likely to judge a historical person by the context of his times. Samuel Spencer was only a teenager at the time seeing his state being invaded by outside forces.

While on the surface, Spencer Shops appears to be the proper place for Samuel, you have to ask where he would he be safe from "the crazies". North Carolina recently allowed the statue of another Confederate soldier named Sam to be pulled down.

I find it sad that the Georgia born Samuel Spencer cannot reside at the NSC headquarters in Georgia. The economic growth in the Southeast which his Southern Railway System facilitated helped to raise the standards of living for all people in the region.

Jack Wyatt

On Thursday, December 19, 2019, 08:45:04 AM EST, George Eichelberger <geichelberger@...> wrote:


I understand there is now a question about what to do with Mr. Spencer’s statue that sits in front of the David Goode building in Atlanta. SRHA members have suggested its proper home is at the shops at Spencer, NC. Although some have mentioned moving it to TVRM, I think the consensus (for what it is worth) is that Spencer is the proper place if not at the NS headquarters.

We have NS President Wick Moorman to thank for making the effort to retrieve the statue from obscurity in Atlanta and moving it to Goode building. In my personal opinion, any railroad or corporation that forgets or ignores its history (NS, in all of its predecessors has as much as anyone) is “pulling the pin” on what has gone before.

(BTW) In the SRHA file on the statue’s dedication, it mentions how SR employees paid for it with deductions from their pay envelopes. The “chits” employees signed for the deductions were sealed in a box below the statue. When the statue’s base was moved, the box was located and opened. Unfortunately, water had entered it long ago and the chits were simply a mass of rotten paper. While the effort failed, it was a fine example of NS wanting to preserve its past.





locked Re: Samuel Spencer

Robert Hanson
 

Jack, you may be right.

All I had to go on was the biography, apparently given to dignitaries, issued for the dedication of the memorial.

I've done nothing to verify the information, so you'll get no argument from me.

Bob Hanson


-----Original Message-----
From: C J Wyatt <cjwyatt@...>
To: main <main@SouthernRailway.groups.io>
Sent: Thu, Dec 19, 2019 9:52 am
Subject: Re: [SouthernRailway] Samuel Spencer

Thank you Bob for that information.

I think the Vicksburg credit is wrong. The unit which he later joined, Nelson Rangers, was part of the Vicksburg campaign. However at the time that Vicksburg took place,  Samuel Spencer appears to have been at at GMI. I think his first combat likely was at Resaca with the GMI Cadets and sometime during the Atlanta Campaign he probably switched over to Nelson Rangers. The answer might be in the letters at the Atlanta History Center. Maybe I can get down there sometime and look.

Jack Wyatt

On Thursday, December 19, 2019, 08:18:34 AM EST, Robert Hanson via Groups.Io <rhanson669@...> wrote:


According to a biography in my collection that was issued at the dedication of the Spencer Memorial in 1910, Samuel Spencer also served at Vicksburg and later under General Nathan Bedford Forrest.  He also served under General Hood in the Atlanta and Nashville campaigns.

The biography makes no mention of his rank, other than the fact that he enlisted as a private at the age of 16, probably in 1863, as his birthday was March 2nd.

Bob Hanson
Loganville, GA


-----Original Message-----
From: C J Wyatt <cjwyatt@...>
To: main <main@SouthernRailway.groups.io>
Sent: Thu, Dec 19, 2019 1:10 am
Subject: Re: [SouthernRailway] Samuel Spencer

Nelson Rangers - Georgia:


Probably did not join until early 1864. See manuscript reference to his letters:


Prior to the Nelson Rangers, he was a cadet at the Georgian Military Institute, company B:


Some have questions about whether part of his service was made up, but most Confederate cavalry units did not keep good service records and burned most of the ones they had by the end of the war. I think the account of his service is truthful.

Jack Wyatt






On Wednesday, December 18, 2019, 10:42:15 PM EST, James Walton <whovianwil@...> wrote:


Hi everyone, I have a few questions on Spencer:

I know he claimed to have served in the Confederate army, but I can't seem to find what unit he served with. Does anyone know the answer to this?

Details of his personal life are quite scarce. Does anyone know anything regarding his personality, political views, interests, or anything of that nature?


locked Re: Samuel Spencer

C J Wyatt
 

Unfortunately, people are become less likely to judge a historical person by the context of his times. Samuel Spencer was only a teenager at the time seeing his state being invaded by outside forces.

While on the surface, Spencer Shops appears to be the proper place for Samuel, you have to ask where he would he be safe from "the crazies". North Carolina recently allowed the statue of another Confederate soldier named Sam to be pulled down.

I find it sad that the Georgia born Samuel Spencer cannot reside at the NSC headquarters in Georgia. The economic growth in the Southeast which his Southern Railway System facilitated helped to raise the standards of living for all people in the region.

Jack Wyatt

On Thursday, December 19, 2019, 08:45:04 AM EST, George Eichelberger <geichelberger@...> wrote:


I understand there is now a question about what to do with Mr. Spencer’s statue that sits in front of the David Goode building in Atlanta. SRHA members have suggested its proper home is at the shops at Spencer, NC. Although some have mentioned moving it to TVRM, I think the consensus (for what it is worth) is that Spencer is the proper place if not at the NS headquarters.

We have NS President Wick Moorman to thank for making the effort to retrieve the statue from obscurity in Atlanta and moving it to Goode building. In my personal opinion, any railroad or corporation that forgets or ignores its history (NS, in all of its predecessors has as much as anyone) is “pulling the pin” on what has gone before.

(BTW) In the SRHA file on the statue’s dedication, it mentions how SR employees paid for it with deductions from their pay envelopes. The “chits” employees signed for the deductions were sealed in a box below the statue. When the statue’s base was moved, the box was located and opened. Unfortunately, water had entered it long ago and the chits were simply a mass of rotten paper. While the effort failed, it was a fine example of NS wanting to preserve its past.





locked Re: Samuel Spencer

C J Wyatt
 

Thank you Bob for that information.

I think the Vicksburg credit is wrong. The unit which he later joined, Nelson Rangers, was part of the Vicksburg campaign. However at the time that Vicksburg took place,  Samuel Spencer appears to have been at at GMI. I think his first combat likely was at Resaca with the GMI Cadets and sometime during the Atlanta Campaign he probably switched over to Nelson Rangers. The answer might be in the letters at the Atlanta History Center. Maybe I can get down there sometime and look.

Jack Wyatt

On Thursday, December 19, 2019, 08:18:34 AM EST, Robert Hanson via Groups.Io <rhanson669@...> wrote:


According to a biography in my collection that was issued at the dedication of the Spencer Memorial in 1910, Samuel Spencer also served at Vicksburg and later under General Nathan Bedford Forrest.  He also served under General Hood in the Atlanta and Nashville campaigns.

The biography makes no mention of his rank, other than the fact that he enlisted as a private at the age of 16, probably in 1863, as his birthday was March 2nd.

Bob Hanson
Loganville, GA


-----Original Message-----
From: C J Wyatt <cjwyatt@...>
To: main <main@SouthernRailway.groups.io>
Sent: Thu, Dec 19, 2019 1:10 am
Subject: Re: [SouthernRailway] Samuel Spencer

Nelson Rangers - Georgia:


Probably did not join until early 1864. See manuscript reference to his letters:


Prior to the Nelson Rangers, he was a cadet at the Georgian Military Institute, company B:


Some have questions about whether part of his service was made up, but most Confederate cavalry units did not keep good service records and burned most of the ones they had by the end of the war. I think the account of his service is truthful.

Jack Wyatt






On Wednesday, December 18, 2019, 10:42:15 PM EST, James Walton <whovianwil@...> wrote:


Hi everyone, I have a few questions on Spencer:

I know he claimed to have served in the Confederate army, but I can't seem to find what unit he served with. Does anyone know the answer to this?

Details of his personal life are quite scarce. Does anyone know anything regarding his personality, political views, interests, or anything of that nature?


locked Re: Samuel Spencer

George Eichelberger
 

I understand there is now a question about what to do with Mr. Spencer’s statue that sits in front of the David Goode building in Atlanta. SRHA members have suggested its proper home is at the shops at Spencer, NC. Although some have mentioned moving it to TVRM, I think the consensus (for what it is worth) is that Spencer is the proper place if not at the NS headquarters.

We have NS President Wick Moorman to thank for making the effort to retrieve the statue from obscurity in Atlanta and moving it to Goode building. In my personal opinion, any railroad or corporation that forgets or ignores its history (NS, in all of its predecessors has as much as anyone) is “pulling the pin” on what has gone before.

(BTW) In the SRHA file on the statue’s dedication, it mentions how SR employees paid for it with deductions from their pay envelopes. The “chits” employees signed for the deductions were sealed in a box below the statue. When the statue’s base was moved, the box was located and opened. Unfortunately, water had entered it long ago and the chits were simply a mass of rotten paper. While the effort failed, it was a fine example of NS wanting to preserve its past.



On Dec 19, 2019, at 8:18 AM, Robert Hanson via Groups.Io <RHanson669@...> wrote:

According to a biography in my collection that was issued at the dedication of the Spencer Memorial in 1910, Samuel Spencer also served at Vicksburg and later under General Nathan Bedford Forrest.  He also served under General Hood in the Atlanta and Nashville campaigns.

The biography makes no mention of his rank, other than the fact that he enlisted as a private at the age of 16, probably in 1863, as his birthday was March 2nd.

Bob Hanson
Loganville, GA


-----Original Message-----
From: C J Wyatt <cjwyatt@...>
To: main <main@SouthernRailway.groups.io>
Sent: Thu, Dec 19, 2019 1:10 am
Subject: Re: [SouthernRailway] Samuel Spencer

Nelson Rangers - Georgia:


Probably did not join until early 1864. See manuscript reference to his letters:


Prior to the Nelson Rangers, he was a cadet at the Georgian Military Institute, company B:


Some have questions about whether part of his service was made up, but most Confederate cavalry units did not keep good service records and burned most of the ones they had by the end of the war. I think the account of his service is truthful.

Jack Wyatt






On Wednesday, December 18, 2019, 10:42:15 PM EST, James Walton <whovianwil@...> wrote:


Hi everyone, I have a few questions on Spencer:

I know he claimed to have served in the Confederate army, but I can't seem to find what unit he served with. Does anyone know the answer to this?

Details of his personal life are quite scarce. Does anyone know anything regarding his personality, political views, interests, or anything of that nature?


locked Re: Samuel Spencer

Robert Hanson
 

According to a biography in my collection that was issued at the dedication of the Spencer Memorial in 1910, Samuel Spencer also served at Vicksburg and later under General Nathan Bedford Forrest.  He also served under General Hood in the Atlanta and Nashville campaigns.

The biography makes no mention of his rank, other than the fact that he enlisted as a private at the age of 16, probably in 1863, as his birthday was March 2nd.

Bob Hanson
Loganville, GA


-----Original Message-----
From: C J Wyatt <cjwyatt@...>
To: main <main@SouthernRailway.groups.io>
Sent: Thu, Dec 19, 2019 1:10 am
Subject: Re: [SouthernRailway] Samuel Spencer

Nelson Rangers - Georgia:


Probably did not join until early 1864. See manuscript reference to his letters:


Prior to the Nelson Rangers, he was a cadet at the Georgian Military Institute, company B:


Some have questions about whether part of his service was made up, but most Confederate cavalry units did not keep good service records and burned most of the ones they had by the end of the war. I think the account of his service is truthful.

Jack Wyatt






On Wednesday, December 18, 2019, 10:42:15 PM EST, James Walton <whovianwil@...> wrote:


Hi everyone, I have a few questions on Spencer:

I know he claimed to have served in the Confederate army, but I can't seem to find what unit he served with. Does anyone know the answer to this?

Details of his personal life are quite scarce. Does anyone know anything regarding his personality, political views, interests, or anything of that nature?


locked Re: Samuel Spencer

C J Wyatt
 

Nelson Rangers - Georgia:


Probably did not join until early 1864. See manuscript reference to his letters:


Prior to the Nelson Rangers, he was a cadet at the Georgian Military Institute, company B:


Some have questions about whether part of his service was made up, but most Confederate cavalry units did not keep good service records and burned most of the ones they had by the end of the war. I think the account of his service is truthful.

Jack Wyatt






On Wednesday, December 18, 2019, 10:42:15 PM EST, James Walton <whovianwil@...> wrote:


Hi everyone, I have a few questions on Spencer:

I know he claimed to have served in the Confederate army, but I can't seem to find what unit he served with. Does anyone know the answer to this?

Details of his personal life are quite scarce. Does anyone know anything regarding his personality, political views, interests, or anything of that nature?


locked Samuel Spencer

James Walton
 

Hi everyone, I have a few questions on Spencer:

I know he claimed to have served in the Confederate army, but I can't seem to find what unit he served with. Does anyone know the answer to this?

Details of his personal life are quite scarce. Does anyone know anything regarding his personality, political views, interests, or anything of that nature?


locked Ed King contact me off-list pls

Jim King
 

Hey Cuz .. contact me off-list please.  I have a question but need your current email addy to send.  Thx.

 

Jim King

http://smokymountainmodelworks.com/

 


--
Jim King
http://smokymountainmodelworks.com


locked Re: Vertagreen tank cars

George Eichelberger
 

Dept of Corrections.....

The Southern fuel oil tank cars were painted black. That would have satisfied the non-revenue car color requirement.

Ike


locked Re: Vertagreen tank cars

George Eichelberger
 

Ed:

That drawing was for a series of tank cars to carry fuel oil, not the phosphate cars (see attached). The fuel oil cars were built under ACF Lot No. 19-15087 and numbered in the non-revenue 995000-995007 series. (By October, 1973, non-revenue rolling stock was supposed to be given unique road number series and paint schemes. The Southern adopted orange for MoW cars and preceded revenue road numbers with “99” to make them unique. The idea was to prevent MoW equipment from being interchanged.

Freight car brown on the company fuel oil cars would not seem to have met that part of the requirement although the 99 road numbers would have. (PS: for other MoW equipment, when the edict came down to paint MoW cars differently, orange was chosen…..for the VP Mechanical (or Engineering?), a Univ of TN grad, the choice must have been obvious.)

The attached copy of SF-30291 is for phosphate tank cars Sou 300-346 (the same as the tank drawing posted yesterday). It is a better than perfect example to illustrate why we say ONLY use stencil drawings for lettering placement, not “font” design. The hand drawn stencils on SF-30291 are painfully obvious.

Ike



On Dec 18, 2019, at 10:41 AM, Edwin Locklin <elocklin@...> wrote:

Ike,
 
Thanks for this copy of the ACF stencil.  Can you tell us what the numbers were that Southern issued for this car?
 
Ed Locklin at mp367.
 
 
 
 
 
From: George Eichelberger
Sent: Tuesday, December 17, 2019 9:10 AM
To: main@SouthernRailway.groups.io
Subject: Re: [SouthernRailway] Vertagreen tank cars
 
Here is a letter size copy of ACF stencil drawing 4-F-3205 of their version of the Southern 100T tank cars used in Phosphoric acid service.

Ike


locked Re: Vertagreen tank cars

 

Ike,
 
Thanks for this copy of the ACF stencil.  Can you tell us what the numbers were that Southern issued for this car?
 
Ed Locklin at mp367.
 
 
 
 
 

From: George Eichelberger
Sent: Tuesday, December 17, 2019 9:10 AM
To: main@SouthernRailway.groups.io
Subject: Re: [SouthernRailway] Vertagreen tank cars
 
Here is a letter size copy of ACF stencil drawing 4-F-3205 of their version of the Southern 100T tank cars used in Phosphoric acid service.

Ike


locked Re: Vertagreen tank cars

George Eichelberger
 

Scott:

I have to wonder how did loaded 100T tank cars effected the ride and handling of passenger trains. (Can someone say if the brake valves had to be adjusted for pass service pressure?) I’ve attached a size reduced, low res scan of drawing SF-21144 showing just the tank (!) for cars 300-346.

Years ago, I heard how cuts of “interior” phosphate cars (to midwestern farmers, not for export) in NB freights on the Clinchfield and C&O effected train handling. I assume there were interior shipments off the Coast Line in Fla. to the L&N but I don’t recall ever hearing or seeking that in the 60s or 70s.

Ike


On Dec 17, 2019, at 10:17 AM, D. Scott Chatfield <blindog@...> wrote:

That drawing was specifically for the fuel cars built in 1973 so there is some minor differences in the data.  For instance, the 1962 built tanks were type ICC111A100W1, and of course, rubber lined.

This has been a most enlightening discussion for me.  I had seen the cars but never knew they were built for revenue service.  And on the back of a passenger train!  Can you imagine Amtrak's reaction if ypu suggested doing that today?!?!


Scott Chatfield

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