Date   
Re: Vulcan 40

Warren Calloway
 



SOU 40 "The Vulcan" at Birmingham, 11/3/46 Photo by F. E. Ardrey, Jr., of B’ham WARREN CALLOWAY COLLECTION 

On Aug 12, 2020, at 5:06 PM, Quay Beck via groups.io <quay@...> wrote:

Has anyone ever modeled the Souern Vulcan 40? 
Anyone have any pictures?

Vulcan 40

Quay Beck
 

Has anyone ever modeled the Souern Vulcan 40? 
Anyone have any pictures?

Southern Logo Lettering size quesiton

Allen Cain
 

When did the size of "The Southern Serves The South" lettering change? Was the larger lettering first or later?  

Allen Cain

moderated Re: Questions about Southern SDs

Al Collins
 

Thanks for that info Don, that is interesting none the less. Its plausible some of SDs did have the low idle retrofitted then.

There is a video on Youtube about training on Saluda and in the video it shows a SD45 cab, and its clearly in low idle. But given the age of the video, I was thinking the sound was dubbed or a simulator, not being a actual Southern SD45. 

On my HO-scale locomotives, the sound file has low idle as well but again, its just a generic file and was wondering if that was prototypical.

Thanks!

Alex




-------- Original message --------
From: Don Usak <donusak@...>
Date: 2020-08-06 00:31 (GMT-05:00)
To: main@SouthernRailway.groups.io
Subject: Re: [SouthernRailway] Questions about Southern SDs

I realize Al's question was in regard to Southern SD locomotives, but Southern did have some GP30s and possibly some GP35s that were equipped with low idle.  This was a homemade system developed by Pete Wydener (sp?), a General Foreman at Chattanooga Diesel Shop.  Pete's system was mounted in the left side of the electrical cabinet behind the panel holding the warning lights, light switches, and the isolation switch.

At least a handful of GP30s were equipped, but I cannot recall how widespread the retrofit may have been.

Don

moderated Re: Questions about Southern SDs

Don Usak
 

I realize Al's question was in regard to Southern SD locomotives, but Southern did have some GP30s and possibly some GP35s that were equipped with low idle.  This was a homemade system developed by Pete Wydener (sp?), a General Foreman at Chattanooga Diesel Shop.  Pete's system was mounted in the left side of the electrical cabinet behind the panel holding the warning lights, light switches, and the isolation switch.

At least a handful of GP30s were equipped, but I cannot recall how widespread the retrofit may have been.

Don

O scale details for a SRR-style RS-3?

Lee Bishop
 

Hello all,
I’ve toyed around for a while with the idea of making an O scale version of ET&WNC RS-3 # 209 or 210, which were CoG engines with all the SRR style parts on them with changed road names (until the white tuxedo stripe got replaced with orange, anyway). Just something to run somewhere if I ever get the chance, as I only mode the ET&WNC in On30, probably in 3-rail but one of the more accurate models around.
I have no idea if anyone makes a SSR-style bell/bracket as well as the correct marker lights in O scale so I could take this project on if I wanted to proceed. I’ve looked around but can’t seem to find anything that’d work. I built this exact thing in HO scale a zillion years ago (sold it at a train show in the 90s, when I got out of HO forever), but we all know in HO scale, you can find almost anything.
Does anyone know if someone makes these parts?
Lee Bishop
 

moderated Re: Questions about Southern SDs

Robert Graham
 

Mr. Collins:

Answers to your queries below in UPPER CASE as I know them.

Bob Graham

-----------------------------------------

From: "Al Collins"
To: "main@SouthernRailway.groups.io"
Cc:
Sent: Monday August 3 2020 5:42:10PM
Subject: [SouthernRailway] Questions about Southern SDs

Being relatively new to researching Southern, would anyone happen to have answers for the following questions:

Were the 35/40/40-2/45s all equipped with low idle? NORMAL IDLE RPM; I BELIEVE LOW IDLE STARTED WITH THE 645F3 PRIME MOVER (GP40X/50 7000-7092)

Did they have dual control stands or except for the 35s, was the long hood always considered "front"? NO SOU DIESEL HAD DUAL CONTROLS. 
ON 2ND GENERATION EMD UNITS, LOOK FOR THE LOCATION OF THE BELL; IT WILL ALWAYS BE MOUNTED ON THE DESIGNATED FRONT ACCORDING TO CONTROL STAND ORIENTATION. 
SD24 SD35 SHORT HOOD FRONT
SD45, SD40, SD40-2 LONG HOOD FRONT
SOU CONSIDERED THEM TO BE BI-DIRECTIONAL AND ALL CLASSES WERE OPERATED EITHER WAY

Is there a spotting feature for determining if one was a lococontrol master? Extra firecracker antenna?
YES. WHITE NUMBER BOARDS WITH BLACK NUMERALS (THE STANDARD FOR SOU DIESELS WAS BLACK WITH WHITE NUMERALS). ALSO, ON EMD LOCOMOTIVES, THE SHORT HOOD NUMBERBOARDS ARE SLIGHTLY BUILT-OUT FROM THE HOOD END SHEET METAL TO PERMIT NUMBER BOARD BULBS TO BE SERVICED FROM OUTSIDE. THEY WERE HINGED AND SWUNG UP. ALSO, THE RADIO COMMUNICATION FIRECRACKER ANTENNA WAS LOCATED ON THE LONG HOOD ON THE DYNAMIC BRAKE RESISTOR BLISTER BETWEEN THE RADIATOR FANS AND DB FANS. THE THROTTLE AND BRAKE CONTROL ANTENNAS WERE BOTH MOUNTED ON THE ROOF OF THE SHORT HOOD ON LOCOTROL EQUIPPED UNITS DURING THE SOU ERA. BE AWARE THAT THE FINAL ORDER OF SD40-2 3312-3328 THE RADIO COMMUNICATION ANTENNA WAS LOCATED OUT ON THE DB RESISTOR BLISTER, BUT THESE SD40-2 WERE NOT LOCOTROL-EQUIPPED.

Were groups of them assigned to specific divisions or would they roam system wide? NO DIVISIONAL ASSIGNMENTS; THEY ROAMED SYSTEM WIDE, BUT LOCOTROL UNITS STAYED USUALLY IN COAL TERRITORY AND HEAVY MAINLINE FREIGHT DUTY.

I know the SD40-2s had P3s then P5 in the last batch. What did the 35s, 40/45s have? CORRECT HORN FOR SD40-2 3201-3254 IS NATHAN P142, COMMONLY CALLED P3, ONE HORN CLUSTER WITH ALL BELLS FACING OUTWARD ON EACH HOOD END. SOU 3255-3328 HAD NATHAN P12345, COMMONLY CALLED P5, WITH ALL 5 BELLS FACING OUTWARD MOUNTED ON EACH HOOD END. 
SD35 HAD NATHAN M5R24
SD40 3170-3200 SAME AS EARLY SD40-2
SD45 3105-3159 LESLIE S-5T-RF MOUNTED ON CAB ROOF
SD45 3100-3104 (2ND), 3160-3169 NATHAN P142 ON EACH HOOD END, SAME AS SD40 AND FIRST GROUP SD40-2. BE AWARE HORNS CAN AND WERE SWAPPED OUT DURING THEIR SERVICE LIVES

Did Southern use steel or bronze bells? BRONZE AS FAR AS I KNOW. THEY WERE BRONZE GOLD WHEN FRESH ON NEW UNITS

As always, any other information regarding these units would be welcome as well.

Thanks,

Alex



Thanks,

Alex


moderated Questions about Southern SDs

Al Collins
 

Being relatively new to researching Southern, would anyone happen to have answers for the following questions:

Were the 35/40/40-2/45s all equipped with low idle? 

Did they have dual control stands or except for the 35s, was the long hood always considered "front"?

Is there a spotting feature for determining if one was a lococontrol master? Extra firecracker antenna?

Were groups of them assigned to specific divisions or would they roam system wide?

I know the SD40-2s had P3s then P5 in the last batch. What did the 35s, 40/45s have?

Did Southern use steel or bronze bells?

As always, any other information regarding these units would be welcome as well.

Thanks,

Alex



Thanks,

Alex


moderated Re: Express Car Movements

George Eichelberger
 

Marv:

The IC-CofG relationship was very strong. There are virtually no references to the Southern handling package car traffic out of Chicago to anywhere on the SRS, except what came via the IC/Central (through B’ham?).

That may have been because the Southern’s package car system appears to be more focused on traffic from Southern territory to various gateway connections and transfer points and between Southern served cities. When the service began around 1906, it reflected the fact that the “South” was a destination of goods, not an originator. The transfer facility at Pot. Yard sent 203 cars to Birmingham (1,698.600 lbs) during the first nine months of 1909.

Here’s are two paragraphs from the TIES package car article…

The largest number of package car routes out of Atlanta to other railroads and ship lines were scheduled from Inman Transfer. Through cars from there went to: Akron, OH (AC&Y), Albany, GA (GSW&G), Charleston, SC (Clyde Lines), Charlotte, NC (NSRR), Chicago,IL (CI&L), Cincinnati (B&O and PRR), Cordele, GA (GS&F), Havana, Cuba (Thursdays, all rail via FEC), Jacksonville, FL (GS&F, FEC, SAL and ACL Fla Transfer), Kansas City (via E. St. Louis and MP), Miami, FL (FEC), Montgomery, AL (A&WP), New Orleans, LA (NO&NE), Springfield,OH (Big Four) and West Palm Beach, FL (FEC).

and…

The Directory also included lists of inbound cars from other railroads, “North of the Ohio River” sent 50 cars. The largest group, 20 cars, came from Chicago. Many were interchanged and routed to the Southern’s Vine St. and Lincoln Park freight stations in Cincinnati but through cars also came to Asheville, Birmingham, Chattanooga, Louisville and Atlanta. A Friday only refrigerator car from the Big Four in Chicago went to Columbia, SC.

Note that the Southern Directory shows 20 cars from Chicago. I need to see if I can locate near that number in the “Bulletin” issues we have.

I’d like to hear some feedback from folks about how interesting they think this kind of material is. We now have so many potential articles we can run in TIES, some may never make the “cut”.

Ike




On Aug 2, 2020, at 9:30 AM, Marv Clemons <mclemonsjr@...> wrote:

Ike, it's very interesting to learn that routings from Chicago to Montgomery via IC-Columbus GA - Central of Georgia were handled in near identical times as the more direct C&EI - L&N, and with only one local train on the Columbus-Montgomery segment vs. multiple schedules on the L&N.

Just one more reason to love the CofG!

Marv Clemons

moderated Re: Express Car Movements

Marv Clemons
 

Ike, it's very interesting to learn that routings from Chicago to Montgomery via IC-Columbus GA - Central of Georgia were handled in near identical times as the more direct C&EI - L&N, and with only one local train on the Columbus-Montgomery segment vs. multiple schedules on the L&N.

Just one more reason to love the CofG!

Marv Clemons

moderated Re: Express Car Movements

George Eichelberger
 

Here is a cover letter and the first two, of sixteen, pages from the August, 1949 Chicago Association of Commerce and Industry “Package Car Service” Bulletin in the SRHA archives.

The term “package car” appears to have been used, at least in the Eastern US, almost universally for shipments that were not using an LCL tariff for loads going to more than one destination or consignee. Pages two through sixteen show package car routes out of Chicago to locations in the US and Canada.

Although I cannot locate a note confirming, the first entry for a route in “VIA” column is obviously the originating Chicago railroad.

There are multiple copies of the “Bulletin" in the SRHA archives in addition to several version of the “Merchandise Car Directory” published by the Southern Railway. I expect all major railroads had similar lists or publications. An article on package cars will be in an upcoming issue of “TIES”, the SRHA magazine.

The Southern chose not to have box cars marked for the service. As Atlanta was the largest source of out bound cars, the logic was there would always be empties in Atlanta to load at the three freight stations (plus Sears Roebuck) so having specially painted cars return empty was not efficient.

Ike





moderated Re: Passenger car documentation in the SRHA archives

 

Ike,
 
Well, I got in a hurry and forgot the attachment.  Here it is.
 
Ed Locklin at mp367.
 

 

From: George Eichelberger
Sent: Thursday, July 30, 2020 8:21 PM
To: main@southernrailway.groups.io
Subject: [SouthernRailway] Passenger car documentation in the SRHA archives
 
I have been scanning documents in the archives on the 1949 order for cars for the Crescent. Here are three examples that tell their own story. Although I do not know how many Budd drawings we have, none are on microfilm, I am looking for drawings lists we can use to start to organize the hard copy drawings. I’m interested in the Budd material because I am working on a number of different models and I’d like to locate any that could be useful as TVRM restores and works on the Southern Budd diner they purchased from Amtrak. We’ll do an article on the diners in TIES and work on a plan to package drawings for people that may want to do some models themselves. (Underfloor passenger car equipment layouts have been the hardest to locate.)
 
Someone may know if the L&N and the A&WP adopted the Budd designs?
 
Ike
 
 
 

moderated Re: Passenger car documentation in the SRHA archives

 

Ike,
 
The attachement to this letter might be what you’re looking for.  It’s a drawing of the Budd-built dining cars # 3305-3312.  I couldn’t find one for the single ordered #3869.
 
Ed Locklin at mp367.
 
 

 

From: George Eichelberger
Sent: Thursday, July 30, 2020 8:21 PM
To: main@southernrailway.groups.io
Subject: [SouthernRailway] Passenger car documentation in the SRHA archives
 
I have been scanning documents in the archives on the 1949 order for cars for the Crescent. Here are three examples that tell their own story. Although I do not know how many Budd drawings we have, none are on microfilm, I am looking for drawings lists we can use to start to organize the hard copy drawings. I’m interested in the Budd material because I am working on a number of different models and I’d like to locate any that could be useful as TVRM restores and works on the Southern Budd diner they purchased from Amtrak. We’ll do an article on the diners in TIES and work on a plan to package drawings for people that may want to do some models themselves. (Underfloor passenger car equipment layouts have been the hardest to locate.)
 
Someone may know if the L&N and the A&WP adopted the Budd designs?
 
Ike
 
 
 

moderated Passenger car documentation in the SRHA archives

George Eichelberger
 

I have been scanning documents in the archives on the 1949 order for cars for the Crescent. Here are three examples that tell their own story. Although I do not know how many Budd drawings we have, none are on microfilm, I am looking for drawings lists we can use to start to organize the hard copy drawings. I’m interested in the Budd material because I am working on a number of different models and I’d like to locate any that could be useful as TVRM restores and works on the Southern Budd diner they purchased from Amtrak. We’ll do an article on the diners in TIES and work on a plan to package drawings for people that may want to do some models themselves. (Underfloor passenger car equipment layouts have been the hardest to locate.)

Someone may know if the L&N and the A&WP adopted the Budd designs?

Ike



moderated Re: New member questions on the St. Louis line

Tim
 

You might want to consider the new book from Morning Sun Books, Southern Railway in Color. It includes a good section on the Louisville to St. Louis line.

Tim Rumph
Lancaster, SC

moderated Re: Large Lot of HO Transition Era Freight and Passenger Cars

George Eichelberger
 

Everyone…please follow Allen’s request and communicate with him off line.

Ike


On Jul 27, 2020, at 7:23 PM, Allen Cain <Allencaintn@...> wrote:

John,

If I understand your question, these are just a part of the model number.  Red Caboose and Intermountain will produce a series of cars using the same mold with different road numbers and put an extension on the part number to designate a particular road number kit.

Hope that helps.

I failed to mention that I ask that all responses come to me direct off line so as to not clutter up this list and I will see them much quicker.

Allen Cain

moderated Re: Large Lot of HO Transition Era Freight and Passenger Cars

Allen Cain
 

John,

If I understand your question, these are just a part of the model number.  Red Caboose and Intermountain will produce a series of cars using the same mold with different road numbers and put an extension on the part number to designate a particular road number kit.

Hope that helps.

I failed to mention that I ask that all responses come to me direct off line so as to not clutter up this list and I will see them much quicker.

Allen Cain

moderated Re: FS: Large Lot of HO Transition Era Freight and Passenger Cars

A&Y Dave in MD
 

It was a pdf attachment. I saw it.

Sent from Dave Bott' iPhone

On Jul 26, 2020, at 6:11 PM, William L Vanderburg <Army30th@...> wrote:

I don't see a list.

moderated Re: FS: Large Lot of HO Transition Era Freight and Passenger Cars

William L Vanderburg
 

I don't see a list.

moderated Re: Large Lot of HO Transition Era Freight and Passenger Cars

John Stewart
 

Hi folks

 

Allen, what do the numbers and letters in the columns between “Model Number” and “Model Price” mean?

 

Sorry if I missed a previous explanation, I have been out of town.

 

Thanks

 

John

 

John R Stewart

www.bhamrails.info

205-901-3790

 

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