Date   
moderated Operating Contract between the Pullman Co. and Southern Railway System

George Eichelberger
 

SRHA is in the process of scanning more than 1,000 contracts, operating agreements, leases, joint facility agreements and equipment trusts. In the next few weeks we should be able to upload scans of the cover of every/most  contracts in the SRHA archives. Here is a complete scan of Southern Railway contract No. 1109 with the Pullman Co. dated January 1, 1946. Because it is most likely the wording Pullman negotiated with every railroad operating Pullmans at that time, I will cross-post it to other groups.io groups.

Note that this is not a "golden age" Pullman agreement! It covers the dissolution of the Pullman Co. where its stock was sold to the railroads but continues "sleeping car" contracts, modified as needed by the court. There are multiple Pullman contracts in the SRHA archives BUT they never include information on specific car line numbers (Pullman routes) or cars. Much of that data is available in the SRHA archives although it is spread out in multiple files.

Ike

moderated Southern FP-7 Details

SouRwyFan
 

Hi all,

I am working on a project and trying to gather info on FP-7's.

Anybody got dimensions or drawings of rooftop piping? (Were they cooling coils or air lines up there?)
Also what about location of backup headlight and other details of rear of units?
I know it's a stretch but what about painting diagram/Spec sheet?

Thanks!
RS

moderated Re: Southern FP-7 Details

O Fenton Wells
 

I know Bob Harp did one of these  on the old Southern Modeler site.  Check to see if it is still there.


On Thu, Feb 7, 2019 at 7:08 PM SouRwyFan via Groups.Io <blackaerocoupe=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hi all,

I am working on a project and trying to gather info on FP-7's.

Anybody got dimensions or drawings of rooftop piping? (Were they cooling coils or air lines up there?)
Also what about location of backup headlight and other details of rear of units?
I know it's a stretch but what about painting diagram/Spec sheet?

Thanks!
RS



--
Fenton Wells
250 Frye Rd
Pinehurst NC 28374
910-420-8106
srrfan1401@...

moderated Re: Southern FP-7 Details

milepost 131 <mp131.ghandrews@...>
 

File section  of the Yahoogroup migrated to groups.io has drawings.

moderated Re: Southern FP-7 Details

George Eichelberger
 

There does not appear to be any drawings of rooftop cooling pipes for FP-7s in the SRHA archive scans. As many early photos of Southern FP-7s do not show the pipes, I expect they were added after delivery by the Southern. If that is correct, the shops may have simply used the drawings created for E-6 and E-7s. I have uploaded one of them before so here is a different, DL-3253, showing how the rooftop pipes were connected to the engine cooling systems. Most of the E-6 pipes had fins to increase their heat dissipation but plain pipes appear to have been used later (a cost consideration as the finned pipes were a special purpose?)

Ike



On Feb 7, 2019, at 6:59 PM, SouRwyFan via Groups.Io <blackaerocoupe@...> wrote:

Hi all,

I am working on a project and trying to gather info on FP-7's.

Anybody got dimensions or drawings of rooftop piping? (Were they cooling coils or air lines up there?)
Also what about location of backup headlight and other details of rear of units?
I know it's a stretch but what about painting diagram/Spec sheet?

Thanks!
RS

moderated Re: Southern FP-7 Details

D. Scott Chatfield
 

As far as I know the long cooling pipes mounted alongside the radiator fans were aftercooler pipes between the air compressor and the main reservoir.  Sounds like the finned pipes on the E6s and E7s had a different purpose.  Remember, the radiators on the early Es were nothing like those on the Fs or E8s.

My understanding is the aftercooler pipes were a retrofit offered by EMD after being made standard on the F9.  So perhaps installed after 1954.  Many railroads added them to their earlier Fs.

In HO, I think Bowser sells an aftercooler pipe assembly for F units.


Scott Chatfield

moderated Re: Southern FP-7 Details

Gary Bechdol
 

Highliners also has aftercooler 
pipes for F-units.

Gary 

On Sat, Feb 9, 2019, 4:18 PM D. Scott Chatfield <blindog@... wrote:
As far as I know the long cooling pipes mounted alongside the radiator fans were aftercooler pipes between the air compressor and the main reservoir.  Sounds like the finned pipes on the E6s and E7s had a different purpose.  Remember, the radiators on the early Es were nothing like those on the Fs or E8s.

My understanding is the aftercooler pipes were a retrofit offered by EMD after being made standard on the F9.  So perhaps installed after 1954.  Many railroads added them to their earlier Fs.

In HO, I think Bowser sells an aftercooler pipe assembly for F units.


Scott Chatfield

moderated Re: Southern FP-7 Details

Justin May
 

Southwest Scale Productions offers HO scale FP7-F9 after cooler piping for sale which is also sold by Highliners.


Justin May

On Feb 9, 2019, at 14:59, D. Scott Chatfield <blindog@...> wrote:

As far as I know the long cooling pipes mounted alongside the radiator fans were aftercooler pipes between the air compressor and the main reservoir.  Sounds like the finned pipes on the E6s and E7s had a different purpose.  Remember, the radiators on the early Es were nothing like those on the Fs or E8s.

My understanding is the aftercooler pipes were a retrofit offered by EMD after being made standard on the F9.  So perhaps installed after 1954.  Many railroads added them to their earlier Fs.

In HO, I think Bowser sells an aftercooler pipe assembly for F units.


Scott Chatfield
<DL-3253 cooling sys mod E6 & E&_B.jpg>

moderated Archives Work Session Feb 22-23

Jim Thurston
 

Just a reminder that the SRHA Archives Work Session will be Friday & Saturday, Feb 22-23

Jim Thurston

moderated It's only a week away (if even that) Feb 23-24 at Fredericksburg, Virginia

Cohen Bob
 



Just a little reminder as the next mid-Atlantic region train show is just about a week away (Next weekend to be exact !).


The show will be at Fredericksburg, Virginia's Convention Center on the Carl Silver Parkway on Saturday and Sunday, February 23-24, 2019 and the hours both days are 10-4. There is an admission fee but it's good for both days.


In addition to there being a number of modular layouts in the rear of the hall, there will also be plenty of dealers offering their various train wares to you for your happy time in your own personal amount of enjoyment, whatever the size may be.


Whether it be the large stuff like G-Scale, or O-27, S, HO, N, Z, the models of those sizes will All be there in some quantity, some greater available than others.


In addition there will also be any number of books and magazines associated with your favorite hobby and also a few of the many dozens of RR HS groups should have some representation there. In the past, the RF&P HS has been represented and perhaps a few others. Many of the popular and your favorite railroads should be well-represented including the B&O, C&O, RF&P, N&W, Amtrak, PRR and many dozens more.


Hope to see you there sometime next weekend. It's not far off I-95 so it is E-Z to find.


Bob Cohen

entered 5:10 PM EST

Saturday, February 16, 2019


moderated Southern Railway Bridge Colors

Kevin von der Lippe
 

The City of Greensboro is working with NS and the NCRR to paint the various railroad bridges within the city limits, and would like to paint them to be historically correct for the Southern Railway.  Does anyone know what the standard paint colors were for the the railroad in the 1930s or 40s?

Thank you,

Kevin von der Lippe

moderated Re: Southern Railway Bridge Colors

Bill Schafer
 

Kevin Van Der Lippe:

I don’t know how the underpasses were painted in the 1940s, but when I was living there in the early-1970s, the McGee Street/Davie Street underpass was a dirty gray or silver, with maybe black underneath. The letter board bearing the name “Southern Railway” was silver too, and from the accompanying photo, the letters were raised and appear to have been painted black (I wonder if this letter board is still there). This is pre-Amtrak train 5, which Southern called the Piedmont, leaving Greensboro at 7:00 am in early 1971. 

35 SOU train 5 leaving Greensboro crossing Elm St. behind 6148 FP7 Mar 1971 GWS photo.jpeg

Here’s another view, taken later the same year, that shows a little bit of the underpass. In this view, it looks to me as if the underpass is silver, and that it needs a paint job. 

SOU 6308 leads two more SD24s across Elm St Greensboro NC with train 159 1971 Bill Schafer photo.tiff

Hope this helps.

—Bill Schafer

On Feb 25, 2019, at 11:10 AM, Kevin von der Lippe <kevin.vonderlippe@...> wrote:

The City of Greensboro is working with NS and the NCRR to paint the various railroad bridges within the city limits, and would like to paint them to be historically correct for the Southern Railway.  Does anyone know what the standard paint colors were for the the railroad in the 1930s or 40s?

Thank you,

Kevin von der Lippe

moderated Re: Southern Railway Bridge Colors

Carl Ardrey
 

This structure still in use by the Aiken RR is between Aiken and Warrenville.

CEA

On February 25, 2019 at 10:10 AM Kevin von der Lippe <kevin.vonderlippe@...> wrote:

The City of Greensboro is working with NS and the NCRR to paint the various railroad bridges within the city limits, and would like to paint them to be historically correct for the Southern Railway.  Does anyone know what the standard paint colors were for the the railroad in the 1930s or 40s?

Thank you,

Kevin von der Lippe

moderated Drawbridge questions

Ron Stafford
 

Can anyone cite the builder(s) and dates for the Charleston Division drawbridges over the Congaree River (SC Line MP 102.6) and over the Wateree River on the SB Line (MP 5.2)?

Also looking for the dates when they were replaced with the current (non-draw) structures.

Thanks,

Ron Stafford

moderated Re: Southern Railway Bridge Colors

Robert Graham
 

While the Sou Ry steel bridges I shot photos of in the 1960's, 1970's, 1980's were silver in color with either black or green lettering like the one Carl Ardrey provided, I believe in the 1940's and earlier, they were painted black with either white or silver or aluminum lettering. I have attached a photo from Charlotte NC made April 24 1947 of a P&N interurban car coming in to Mint St station. The Sou Ry main line to Columbia SC passed over the P&N station approach tracks (just about where BOA Stadium is now) at that time before being relocated when the old passenger station was closed and SOU lines relocated in and around Charlotte as a result circa 1960 or thereabouts. While a B&W photo, the steel trestle girders are clearly a dark color with light lettering. I suspect this was also the case in Greensboro, as bridge colors were usually system wide and not subject to division preferences.

Also, to answer Bill Schafer's question regarding the presence of the Southern Railway letterboard on the Davie St overpass in Greensboro, it is long gone, removed by NS about the same time the other SOU bridge lettering was removed a few years after the merger. I don't think it was saved, but do not know, but if not, too bad.

Bob Graham



---- Kevin von der Lippe <kevin.vonderlippe@...> wrote:

The City of Greensboro is working with NS and the NCRR to paint the various railroad bridges within the city limits, and would like to paint them to be historically correct for the Southern Railway.  Does anyone know what the standard paint colors were for the the railroad in the 1930s or 40s?

Thank you,

Kevin von der Lippe


moderated Re: Southern Railway Bridge Colors

sgwarner88@...
 

I also do not know with authenticity the colors of steel structures in the 30's, but I do know that SR "greased" its steel structures in the 70's to preserve the steel. However, SR had a unit train fall through a bridge into the Big Warrior River in the late 70's, and I was there during the restoration process.  It was a through truss of which a hanger had broken.  So SR hired an ultrasonic inspection of the entire trestle, after scraping it clean.  I watched them run the tests (and I wrote the Bridge Inspection Standard Procedure), and they discovered multiple cracked hangers that the grease hid.  So SR/Joel DeValle (I believe) ordered all steel to be degreased and uncovered after that.

moderated Re: Southern Railway Bridge Colors

Kevin von der Lippe
 

Thank you for all of you help.  I have forwarded all the comments to the City of Greensboro.

 

Kevin von der Lippe

moderated SRHA Archives Work Session this weekend

Jim Thurston
 

The SRHA Archives Work Session for March will be this weekend, Friday & Saturday, March 15 & 16.
 
The schedule for future Work Sessions may be found at SRHA.net (on the first page)
 
The remaining sessions for 2019 are as follows:
 
Apr 26-27
May 17-18
Jun 21-22
Jul 19-20
Aug 16-17
Sep 20-21
Oct 18-19
Nov 15-16
Dec 13-14
 
If you want to come at other times, please send me an email.
 
Ike is recovering well from his hip replacement and should be able to come this weekend.
 
We continue our extended Christmas celebration by opening more presents (unprocessed boxes - surprises!)
 
Hope you can come!
 
Jim Thurston

moderated Southern 72747

George Eichelberger
 

Here are three photos of Southern 70-ton hopper 72747 derailed and on its side just outside the mine at the very north end of the Roda or Stonega Interstate mine spurs. The tipple is uphill to the left. The switch, like a safety track, was normally set for the siding to keep cars from running away down the valley. Although rails had been removed to insure cars were derailed, note one photo taken from the other end shows the siding curving off to the left. We did not walk that line but I suspect it was a derail or safety track rather than a lead to another mine.

Ike

moderated Southern bulkhead flat 116184

George Eichelberger
 

To answer a question about the decking on Southern Greenville Steel Car bulkhead flats, here is the title block half of GSC drawing 36028 but I do not see any references to the planks being wood or steel. The photo of Southern 116184, I took at Atlanta July 2001 shows their wood decks clearly.

The early Intermountain (?) center beam flat may provide a starting point for one of the bulkhead versions. The tie down ratchets on the kit are very nice and starting with an underframe and deck would save a lot of scratchbuilding. I have lost track of which Southern car had the same truck centers although that length could be modified rather easily.

Ike