Date   
moderated Evaluation and Purchase of New Diesel Locomotives

Charles Harris
 

Hi
In 1946 Southern evaluated and tested the Ingalls 4-S  diesel loco.  The loco finally purchased by GM&O.

I expect there would have been evaluation reports and recommendations done by Southern.  George:  can you keep an eye out for any documentation during your travels thru all the Southern records.  Thanks.

Ingalls Iron Works in Birmingham AL had a hand in the build (together with Ingalls Shipbuilding MS)  In Birmingham the trackage went right by/thru? the Ingalls factory (on Avenue F ?).  There is a possibility that Ingalls would have had to get Southern permission to access the trackage for commissioning and testing.  Any thoughts?

Thanks

Charles Harris

moderated Ordering Copies of Documents from the Archives

Tim
 

Ike;

Thank you for making us aware of the materials available in the SRHA archives. I think that this is a valuable resource that not enough people use. 

I realize that the archives are sort of in flux right now, with the move to Chattanooga. I know that it included a partial index before the move. Unfortunately, getting to Chattanooga for the work sessions isn't going to work for me right now, because of constraints on my vacation time and competing interests. I also don't want to distract people from the good work they're doing to deal with my requests. When do you think that will be far enough along?

I particularly liked your sample ICC valuation reports and look forward to getting some copies of these when things have settled down there in Chattanooga.

Tim Rumph
Lancaster, SC

moderated Re: Ordering Copies of Documents from the Archives

George Eichelberger
 

Tim:

For a start, you are welcome to download the Val Section scans on Google Drive.

All of the summaries (the blue prints) for the Southern records have been scanned but not many of the semi-annual submissions have been done. They can be scanned with a sheet feeder but only with a few at a time so manpower to do the work is the limiting factor. (There are 2,302 scans for just the summaries (4.21Gb) but I could not guess how many Val Section updates pages there are. The “ICC Scans” file today has 5,527 items using 153 Gb of memory. Buying more scanners and updating our PCs are two items where we can use some help. We have a high speed fiber optic Internet connection but we want to acquire and install our own server.)

The number sounds bizarre but we had to weigh everything for the move so I am accurate when I say we moved 30 TONS of archives materials from Kennesaw. The photo tour on the SRHA web site (www.srha.net in the archives section provides a rough idea of how much that is.

With everything that needs to be done, it’s hard to predict when anything will be finished. Our first two priorities are researching material for TIES Magazine articles and working with manufacturers that ask for information for future products. Requests from individuals simply cannot be given a high priority.

Ike






On Sep 26, 2018, at 4:47 PM, Tim <tarumph@...> wrote:

Ike;

Thank you for making us aware of the materials available in the SRHA archives. I think that this is a valuable resource that not enough people use. 

I realize that the archives are sort of in flux right now, with the move to Chattanooga. I know that it included a partial index before the move. Unfortunately, getting to Chattanooga for the work sessions isn't going to work for me right now, because of constraints on my vacation time and competing interests. I also don't want to distract people from the good work they're doing to deal with my requests. When do you think that will be far enough along?

I particularly liked your sample ICC valuation reports and look forward to getting some copies of these when things have settled down there in Chattanooga.

Tim Rumph
Lancaster, SC

moderated ICC "Investment in Road and Equipment"

George Eichelberger
 

The ICC Valuation Process has an instruction manual. It is not light reading but it does explain the process to be followed and, most important to us, the various accounts to be used for different categories of investments.

The ICC records are in ledger size binders in the SRHA archives. As soon as our Spacesaver shelving is installed next month, they can be catalouged, unpacked and accessible to be researched or scanned.

The link to download the PDF on Google Drive is:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1AWqzQpHi4kW8J0TznhRUTnhJxGiM-p3K/view?usp=sharing

Ike

moderated Re: ICC "Investment in Road and Equipment"

rwbrv4
 

Ike pages 16/17 are missing from this document.  
Rick 


-----Original Message-----
From: George Eichelberger <geichelberger@...>
To: SouthernRailway <SouthernRailway@groups.io>
Sent: Thu, Sep 27, 2018 9:58 am
Subject: [SouthernRailway] ICC "Investment in Road and Equipment"

The ICC Valuation Process has an instruction manual. It is not light reading but it does explain the process to be followed and, most important to us, the various accounts to be used for different categories of investments.

The ICC records are in ledger size binders in the SRHA archives. As soon as our Spacesaver shelving is installed next month, they can be catalouged, unpacked and accessible to be researched or scanned.

The link to download the PDF on Google Drive is:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1AWqzQpHi4kW8J0TznhRUTnhJxGiM-p3K/view?usp=sharing

Ike




moderated Re: Evaluation and Purchase of New Diesel Locomotives

George Eichelberger
 

Charles:

While researching the Southern diesel book, I found a reference to the Ingalls locomotive. I will dig though what I've accumulated and see if I can find that reference.

We will also look in the Oscar Kimsey industrial loco photo file to see what it may have. Oscar's Industrial photos and negatives are as extensive as I have ever seen on the subject. If someone was interested, we could produce a book of Oscar's (and other) photos. A second collection, acquired by Oscar, includes large format negatives of industrial, short line and main line steam. Marvelous material!

Ike

moderated Re: ICC "Investment in Road and Equipment"

rwbrv4
 

Ike pages 16 and 17 are missing from this.
Rick




On Thursday, September 27, 2018 George Eichelberger <SouthernRailway@groups.io> wrote:

The ICC Valuation Process has an instruction manual. It is not light reading but it does explain the process to be followed and, most important to us, the various accounts to be used for different categories of investments.

The ICC records are in ledger size binders in the SRHA archives. As soon as our Spacesaver shelving is installed next month, they can be catalouged, unpacked and accessible to be researched or scanned.

The link to download the PDF on Google Drive is:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1AWqzQpHi4kW8J0TznhRUTnhJxGiM-p3K/view?usp=sharing

Ike




moderated Glad to be on board

mclemons@...
 

Thanks for the invitation to membership.  

May I suggest a different photo for the home page?  Seeing a herd of elephants, at first I thought I might have been fooled into joining a Republican party interest group.  Or have I ??? ;o)

~ Marv Clemons

moderated Re: Glad to be on board

George Eichelberger
 

Marv:

I just fixed the photo….

I could not figure out how to replace the elephants but it turned out it took longer to upload the photo than I was giving it to finish. Waddya think of the replacement? 

The photo is by David Driscoll. We obtained his slides with the Marvin Black collection. When I first looked through Marvin’s material I could not believe there were 35mm Kodak slides with a RED border. I understand they started out that way with ASA 10 Kodachrome.

For the SR steam fans among us, the SRHA archives include 3,560 color and B&W scans of steam engines….with many (!) hundreds more photos and negatives to be scanned. In addition to photos, there are 1,004 scans of SR steam loco drawings.

The Oscar Kimsey collection includes hundreds more steam negatives and photos from other railroads. 107 of Oscar’s L&N cab photos and 458 L&N MoW photos have been scanned. (Of course, our friends at the L&NHS already have them.) A future project will be to scan the hundreds of ACL, SAL, GA, A&WP, etc. negatives.

Ike


On Sep 27, 2018, at 1:23 PM, mclemons@... wrote:

Thanks for the invitation to membership.  

May I suggest a different photo for the home page?  Seeing a herd of elephants, at first I thought I might have been fooled into joining a Republican party interest group.  Or have I ??? ;o)

~ Marv Clemons

moderated Re: Evaluation and Purchase of New Diesel Locomotives

Charles Harris
 

Hi Ike


Thanks for your email and offer to locate reference re Ingalls.  No hurry to locate just when you come across it again.

Regards


Charles

New Zealand


On 28/09/18 03:45, George Eichelberger wrote:
Charles:

While researching the Southern diesel book, I found a reference to the Ingalls locomotive. I will dig though what I've accumulated and see if I can find that reference.

We will also look in the Oscar Kimsey industrial loco photo file to see what it may have. Oscar's Industrial photos and negatives are as extensive as I have ever seen on the subject. If someone was interested, we could produce a book of Oscar's (and other) photos. A second collection, acquired by Oscar, includes large format negatives of industrial, short line and main line steam. Marvelous material!

Ike

moderated Re: Glad to be on board

Carl Ardrey
 

Or an Alabama football site.

moderated A&Y locomotive roster pages expanded and updated

A&Y Dave in MD
 

Dear list,

I've been organizing and scanning my prints as well as my collected electronic images of A&Y locomotives for several months.  In addition, I'm combing through the correspondence files to find evidence of locomotives leased or rented from the Southern or at least considered for the A&Y. I've posted many of the results on my website. The blurb on my index page is:

I have added another 15 pages on unique locomotives and doubled or tripled the total number of locomotive photos available on all the pages. Some of the stories are interesting, like
313, 541 or 803, and sometimes you find a really nice photo like the 254. And sometimes, it is about the not-quite-A&Y locomotives that remained in Southern livery their whole service life, such as 516, 655 and 659.  So check out the added loco pages, but revisit the old ones to see lots of new photos. I would start with the updated roster table on the locomotive page.

For those of you not familiar with the A&Y, it is the Atlantic & Yadkin Railway that ran from Sanford through Greensboro to Mount Airy in NC. It was a wholly owned subsidiary of the Southern from 1899-1950 when it was absorbed into the Winston-Salem division after it's bonds came due and the Southern just paid them off and absorbed the line as it tried to financially as well as organizationally simplify the amalgam created from bankruptcy and acquisition up to that time. My brief history of the line is
here.

This little steam only short line has held my historical interest for over 25 years. Along with members of the Greensboro Chapter of the NRHS, I have been collecting information and displaying it on my web site or publishing what I can (including an article in TIES a few years ago). If you browse my site, you will see station data, industries served, lists of employees, and stories of all the folks who have helped me research this line. The home page is
http://southern-railway.railfan.net/ay/ 

Dave

--

Sent from David Bott's desktop pc

moderated Roof hatch boxcar uses

D. Scott Chatfield
 

A friend asked me today if the Southern's roof hatch boxcars (AAR class LC) were used for anything other than kaolin.  When I worked there they were mostly used for kaolin shipments to Mexico, and I think a customer or two in New England that couldn't unload covered hoppers.  Is anyone aware of another commodity shipped in these cars?

Bob Harpe from Savannah, one long time and prolific modeler of the Southern, has given clinics about the roof hatch boxes.  He has also been the host of the RPM meets in Savannah for years.  I'm told he had a heart attack this week so please keep him in your prayers.

Scott Chatfield


Scott Chatfield

moderated Re: Roof hatch boxcar uses

George Eichelberger
 

Scott:

Sorry for the delay posting you question. A list moderator has to okay only the first post from a subscriber. There is no way to change that but it would keep us from being overrun by a spammer.

I've attached one page from the May, 1973 roof hatch car assignment list. We can post whatever is in the archives files. The lists include both 40 and 50 ft cars and
show clay, bauxite and phosphate. I can add one more commodity I have seen in the files, aluminum dross from Ford. We need to confirm but those few cars were very early and I remember only had two roof hatches. Is anyone aware of other shippers or loads?

We have accumulated plenty of material for a TIES article on these cars if anyone would like to take that on as a project.

For modelers, the WrightTrack model builds into a very good looking car. I've attached a photo of one I did before it was completely decaled and weathered.
Ike

moderated Southern Railway Valuation Section Maps

George Eichelberger
 

Before posting some examples of rolling stock data from the ICC forms, here are the "index" maps showing the Valuation Sections for the Southern Railway. Note that other parts of the "Southern Railway System" are not included. The CNO&TP, AGS, etc. had their own accounts and ICC reporting requirements. We have many of those documents in the archives but we need to do a complete inventory (and make scans if there is interest).

To limit the size of this email, they are on Google Drive at the following link:
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1x9OWOMvx10j2tdDZbLlVmNFaJlvYuGIL?usp=sharing

Eventually, we will establish a digital archive at Chattanooga with an off-site backup. There is already a high speed fiber optic link to the archives building that gives us excellent WiFi connectivity. Anyone knowledgable about the Internet and data servers is welcome to help plan, acquire and install the server hardware. We will then be able to transition SRHA archives documents onto our own searchable platform and not rely on services such as Google Drive.

Ike

moderated Re: Southern Railway Valuation Section Maps

Tim
 

Thanks Ike. This should help finding things even in other collections. I'll be going to the Washington, DC, area this week for the MER convention. If things are on time, I may hit the Library of Congress to look at these documents there. The section I'm interested in is labeled 33. What does that refer to?

To any others that have done this before, any tips on investigating documents at the LOC?

Thanks,
Tim Rumph
Lancaster, SC

moderated Re: Southern Railway Valuation Section Maps

George Eichelberger
 

Tim:

I understand the ICC records (the originals) are in a warehouse in MD. I cannot imagine how big the place must be after seeing the scope of what SRHA has for just the Southern and CofG…imagine the PRR or UP!

The “33” you are seeing is most likely the Valuation Section number for the line segment you are interested in. All of the fixed plant (i.e not rolling stock or “unassigned”) records are based on the State and Val Section. Val sections are on a state by state basis, the numbers may be repeated. I expect you want NC Val Section 33. Note also, you want to make sure you find the different accounts 15, 16, whatever, that include depots, water stations, etc. for that Section. They may appear in different books and an account may only be found in the year a change was made to that category. 

I will post some rolling stock records later today or tomorrow. Those records are reasonably good at showing predecessor railroads’ car numbers, built dates, original costs, etc. The oldest piece of Southern MoW equipment I found dated back to the Civil War. It was included in the initial Engineering Reports but gone by 1916.

 Ike


On Oct 1, 2018, at 1:53 PM, Tim <tarumph@...> wrote:

Thanks Ike. This should help finding things even in other collections. I'll be going to the Washington, DC, area this week for the MER convention. If things are on time, I may hit the Library of Congress to look at these documents there. The section I'm interested in is labeled 33. What does that refer to?

To any others that have done this before, any tips on investigating documents at the LOC?

Thanks,
Tim Rumph
Lancaster, SC

moderated Re: Southern Railway Valuation Section Maps

A&Y Dave in MD
 

You actually want the National Archives and Records Administration in College Park.  Note that this is a multi-day visit most times. You order things, they find them on MASSIVE compact shelving units, they bring them to a viewing room. No pens, only pencils to avoid marking anything permanently. Digital image equipment allowed.


Dave

Sent from Dave Bott' iPhone

On Oct 1, 2018, at 1:53 PM, Tim <tarumph@...> wrote:

Thanks Ike. This should help finding things even in other collections. I'll be going to the Washington, DC, area this week for the MER convention. If things are on time, I may hit the Library of Congress to look at these documents there. The section I'm interested in is labeled 33. What does that refer to?

To any others that have done this before, any tips on investigating documents at the LOC?

Thanks,
Tim Rumph
Lancaster, SC

moderated Re: Southern Railway Valuation Section Maps

Tim
 

Thanks Dave. Sounds like a subject for a trip next year, since my vacation's done for this year.

Tim Rumph
Lancaster, SC


On Mon, Oct 1, 2018 at 08:06 PM, A&Y Dave in MD wrote:
You actually want the National Archives and Records Administration in College Park.  Note that this is a multi-day visit most times. You order things, they find them on MASSIVE compact shelving units, they bring them to a viewing room. No pens, only pencils to avoid marking anything permanently. Digital image equipment allowed.
 
 
Dave

moderated TIES Magazine, SRHA's Quarterly Journal

Bill Schafer
 

TIES Magazine is the quarterly journal of the Southern Railway Historical Association. It is nominally 32 pages, with prototype articles, mention of notable restorations of Southern Railway equipment or structures, personality profiles (and obituaries), and many other tidbits pertaining to the Premier Carrier of the South. TIES for the 3rd quarter of 2018 (2018-3) is at the printer and will be mailed in the next week or two. TIES has been published since 1987, first as a bimonthly magazine, and, since 2012, as a quarterly. White River Productions does a professional job laying out the magazine, and they arrange for its printing and distribution.

Here's the cover of the 2018-3 TIES. Spoiler alert: much of the subject matter relates to Winston-Salem, N.C. We will also feature additional articles about the Southern in Winston-Salem in 2018-4 TIES. 

Speaking of 2018-4 TIES, here are some other articles we're planning: Southern's Spring Street office building renovation; restoration of an E8 and a 1970 boxcar; first person account of a close call on a Washington Division local freight; and (if space permits) a retrospective of Southern's 2-10-2s.

We have compiled a table of contents for all TIES since 2012. It's in an Excel spreadsheet, so it's searchable. All back issues are available from SRHA - check our website (www.srha.net) for pricing and shipping. 

We are always looking for Southern Railway-related articles to share with our membership - if you have a story to tell, send it to us. Just be sure to have enough source material to make a good article, and if you have some images to go with it, so much the better. Don't worry if think you can't write - that's what editors are for.

--Bill Schafer, Co-editor, TIES Magazine