locked Mose Siskin part 2


Warren Stephens
 

As for who ran the TAG, the TAG had a series of absentee owners. The investor Russell Sage, the railroad investor Newman Erb and the Coverdale syndicate. Only Siskin and earlier the Chambliss syndicate, were local. Of the last three presidents - or day to day managers- of TAG, two were former Southern executives. The last was former SOU ex. vp Macon Tollison.

Warren D. Stephens


Robert Hanson
 

Macon Tolleson was one of  Brosnan victims.

I don't recall if he quit or was fired, but he is one of the many capable men lost to the Southern due to Brosnan's whims.

The gory details are in the two-volume biography of DWB.

Bob Hanson
Loganville, GA


-----Original Message-----
From: Warren Stephens <wdstephens@...>
To: main@SouthernRailway.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2020 12:41 pm
Subject: [SouthernRailway] Mose Siskin part 2

As for who ran the TAG, the TAG had a series of absentee owners. The investor Russell Sage, the railroad investor Newman Erb and the Coverdale syndicate. Only Siskin and earlier the Chambliss syndicate, were local. Of the last three presidents - or day to day managers- of TAG, two were former Southern executives. The last was former SOU ex. vp Macon Tollison.

Warren D. Stephens



Warren Stephens
 

Very true Bob but his loyalty remained with Southern. He had a big part in persuading Mr. Siskin to sell the profitable TAG to Southern. Some people with secondhand knowledge claim that the Siskins had a poor relationship with the L&N and would not even think of letting them have it. I have never been able to prove this so just hearsay. The TAG corporate documents were destroyed by Southern so you have to look at the TAG files of other railroads to get much. The CofG file on TAG was very helpful. If the L&N/NC&STL files on TAG still exist I have never been able to find them. 

WDS


On Jul 1, 2020, at 1:03 PM, Robert Hanson via groups.io <RHanson669@...> wrote:

Macon Tolleson was one of  Brosnan victims.

I don't recall if he quit or was fired, but he is one of the many capable men lost to the Southern due to Brosnan's whims.

The gory details are in the two-volume biography of DWB.

Bob Hanson
Loganville, GA


-----Original Message-----
From: Warren Stephens <wdstephens@...>
To: main@SouthernRailway.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2020 12:41 pm
Subject: [SouthernRailway] Mose Siskin part 2

As for who ran the TAG, the TAG had a series of absentee owners. The investor Russell Sage, the railroad investor Newman Erb and the Coverdale syndicate. Only Siskin and earlier the Chambliss syndicate, were local. Of the last three presidents - or day to day managers- of TAG, two were former Southern executives. The last was former SOU ex. vp Macon Tollison.

Warren D. Stephens



Robert Hanson
 

From what I've read and heard, the TAG's relationship with the Southern was not all beer and skittles, either.

The TAG made a living by short-hauling the Southern.  It paralleled the AGS for its (TAG's) entire length and if the Southern participated in the haul at all, it got, as I said, the short haul.

Hardly a situation to endear the TAG to the Southern.

As I understand it, the TAG considered the Southern to be only the lesser of the two evils, and by what margin it might be embarrassing to say.

I was working for the Southern in Internal Audit at the time the Southern purchased the TAG (effective 1-1-71) and we sent an audit team to go over the TAG's books and general affairs.  I was not part of that team.

There was some discussion of the past relationship between the two carriers.

Bob Hanson
Loganville, GA




-----Original Message-----
From: Warren Stephens <wdstephens@...>
To: main@SouthernRailway.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2020 1:21 pm
Subject: Re: [SouthernRailway] Mose Siskin part 2

Very true Bob but his loyalty remained with Southern. He had a big part in persuading Mr. Siskin to sell the profitable TAG to Southern. Some people with secondhand knowledge claim that the Siskins had a poor relationship with the L&N and would not even think of letting them have it. I have never been able to prove this so just hearsay. The TAG corporate documents were destroyed by Southern so you have to look at the TAG files of other railroads to get much. The CofG file on TAG was very helpful. If the L&N/NC&STL files on TAG still exist I have never been able to find them. 

WDS


On Jul 1, 2020, at 1:03 PM, Robert Hanson via groups.io <RHanson669@...> wrote:

Macon Tolleson was one of  Brosnan victims.

I don't recall if he quit or was fired, but he is one of the many capable men lost to the Southern due to Brosnan's whims.

The gory details are in the two-volume biography of DWB.

Bob Hanson
Loganville, GA


-----Original Message-----
From: Warren Stephens <wdstephens@...>
To: main@SouthernRailway.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2020 12:41 pm
Subject: [SouthernRailway] Mose Siskin part 2

As for who ran the TAG, the TAG had a series of absentee owners. The investor Russell Sage, the railroad investor Newman Erb and the Coverdale syndicate. Only Siskin and earlier the Chambliss syndicate, were local. Of the last three presidents - or day to day managers- of TAG, two were former Southern executives. The last was former SOU ex. vp Macon Tollison.

Warren D. Stephens



Byron Osborn
 

Warren, thanks for the information on the TAG.  Looking forward to seeing you book someday.  Other than watching the TAG and the AGS, not sure why you would visit Collinsville.  Hope to talk to you more about the TAG someday.  

Byron Osborn


Warren Stephens
 

The flea market. 

WDS


On Jul 1, 2020, at 2:41 PM, Byron Osborn <bosborn10@...> wrote:

Warren, thanks for the information on the TAG.  Looking forward to seeing you book someday.  Other than watching the TAG and the AGS, not sure why you would visit Collinsville.  Hope to talk to you more about the TAG someday.  

Byron Osborn


Warren Stephens
 

Southern only began to pay the TAG any real attention after WW2. TAG traffic levels increased after the war and as the TAG's primary northern outlet from Chattanooga this miffed Southern. Because as you said the Southern could have handled anything TAG and L&N handled jointly. In the mid 50s, Southern did try and bully TAG out of business. Backfired on them in a dramatic fashion. It was this ugliness that caused Siskin to buy TAG. He was a friendly witness in court for TAG. Not because he was partisan but because he liked having two options when shipping scrap steel by rail to Republic Steel near Gadsden. Southern tried to be a bully with him and punish him over his testimony. So he bought TAG and gave them all his business. I would go into all that but it's more than a none TAG fan or Chattanooga region historian would care to hear. In the end Siskin was just old with nobody to leave his empire to, so he began to divest. Not to say that TAG didn't have obstacles to overcome to stay relevant. Things like expanding the Pigeon Mountain tunnel beyond class C. Southern was upfront with Siskin. They told him that they would be taking the TAG's bridge traffic. But TAG had begun a program to attract online industry and Southern promised Siskin they would continue. History had proven they were less than sincere and when Siskin died, they yanked up the majority of the railroad.    

Warren D. Stephens           

On Wednesday, July 1, 2020, 01:29:52 PM EDT, Robert Hanson via groups.io <rhanson669@...> wrote:


From what I've read and heard, the TAG's relationship with the Southern was not all beer and skittles, either.

The TAG made a living by short-hauling the Southern.  It paralleled the AGS for its (TAG's) entire length and if the Southern participated in the haul at all, it got, as I said, the short haul.

Hardly a situation to endear the TAG to the Southern.

As I understand it, the TAG considered the Southern to be only the lesser of the two evils, and by what margin it might be embarrassing to say.

I was working for the Southern in Internal Audit at the time the Southern purchased the TAG (effective 1-1-71) and we sent an audit team to go over the TAG's books and general affairs.  I was not part of that team.

There was some discussion of the past relationship between the two carriers.

Bob Hanson
Loganville, GA




-----Original Message-----
From: Warren Stephens <wdstephens@...>
To: main@SouthernRailway.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2020 1:21 pm
Subject: Re: [SouthernRailway] Mose Siskin part 2

Very true Bob but his loyalty remained with Southern. He had a big part in persuading Mr. Siskin to sell the profitable TAG to Southern. Some people with secondhand knowledge claim that the Siskins had a poor relationship with the L&N and would not even think of letting them have it. I have never been able to prove this so just hearsay. The TAG corporate documents were destroyed by Southern so you have to look at the TAG files of other railroads to get much. The CofG file on TAG was very helpful. If the L&N/NC&STL files on TAG still exist I have never been able to find them. 

WDS


On Jul 1, 2020, at 1:03 PM, Robert Hanson via groups.io <RHanson669@...> wrote:

Macon Tolleson was one of  Brosnan victims.

I don't recall if he quit or was fired, but he is one of the many capable men lost to the Southern due to Brosnan's whims.

The gory details are in the two-volume biography of DWB.

Bob Hanson
Loganville, GA


-----Original Message-----
From: Warren Stephens <wdstephens@...>
To: main@SouthernRailway.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2020 12:41 pm
Subject: [SouthernRailway] Mose Siskin part 2

As for who ran the TAG, the TAG had a series of absentee owners. The investor Russell Sage, the railroad investor Newman Erb and the Coverdale syndicate. Only Siskin and earlier the Chambliss syndicate, were local. Of the last three presidents - or day to day managers- of TAG, two were former Southern executives. The last was former SOU ex. vp Macon Tollison.

Warren D. Stephens



Robert Hanson
 

Warren, that pretty well agrees with what I've heard and read.

Siskin bought the TAG basically to give the Southern the single-finger salute.

And apparently did so successfully.

Bob Hanson
Loganville, GA


-----Original Message-----
From: Warren Stephens <wdstephens@...>
To: main@SouthernRailway.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2020 6:19 pm
Subject: Re: [SouthernRailway] Mose Siskin part 2

Southern only began to pay the TAG any real attention after WW2. TAG traffic levels increased after the war and as the TAG's primary northern outlet from Chattanooga this miffed Southern. Because as you said the Southern could have handled anything TAG and L&N handled jointly. In the mid 50s, Southern did try and bully TAG out of business. Backfired on them in a dramatic fashion. It was this ugliness that caused Siskin to buy TAG. He was a friendly witness in court for TAG. Not because he was partisan but because he liked having two options when shipping scrap steel by rail to Republic Steel near Gadsden. Southern tried to be a bully with him and punish him over his testimony. So he bought TAG and gave them all his business. I would go into all that but it's more than a none TAG fan or Chattanooga region historian would care to hear. In the end Siskin was just old with nobody to leave his empire to, so he began to divest. Not to say that TAG didn't have obstacles to overcome to stay relevant. Things like expanding the Pigeon Mountain tunnel beyond class C. Southern was upfront with Siskin. They told him that they would be taking the TAG's bridge traffic. But TAG had begun a program to attract online industry and Southern promised Siskin they would continue. History had proven they were less than sincere and when Siskin died, they yanked up the majority of the railroad.    

Warren D. Stephens           

On Wednesday, July 1, 2020, 01:29:52 PM EDT, Robert Hanson via groups.io <rhanson669@...> wrote:


From what I've read and heard, the TAG's relationship with the Southern was not all beer and skittles, either.

The TAG made a living by short-hauling the Southern.  It paralleled the AGS for its (TAG's) entire length and if the Southern participated in the haul at all, it got, as I said, the short haul.

Hardly a situation to endear the TAG to the Southern.

As I understand it, the TAG considered the Southern to be only the lesser of the two evils, and by what margin it might be embarrassing to say.

I was working for the Southern in Internal Audit at the time the Southern purchased the TAG (effective 1-1-71) and we sent an audit team to go over the TAG's books and general affairs.  I was not part of that team.

There was some discussion of the past relationship between the two carriers.

Bob Hanson
Loganville, GA




-----Original Message-----
From: Warren Stephens <wdstephens@...>
To: main@SouthernRailway.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2020 1:21 pm
Subject: Re: [SouthernRailway] Mose Siskin part 2

Very true Bob but his loyalty remained with Southern. He had a big part in persuading Mr. Siskin to sell the profitable TAG to Southern. Some people with secondhand knowledge claim that the Siskins had a poor relationship with the L&N and would not even think of letting them have it. I have never been able to prove this so just hearsay. The TAG corporate documents were destroyed by Southern so you have to look at the TAG files of other railroads to get much. The CofG file on TAG was very helpful. If the L&N/NC&STL files on TAG still exist I have never been able to find them. 

WDS


On Jul 1, 2020, at 1:03 PM, Robert Hanson via groups.io <RHanson669@...> wrote:

Macon Tolleson was one of  Brosnan victims.

I don't recall if he quit or was fired, but he is one of the many capable men lost to the Southern due to Brosnan's whims.

The gory details are in the two-volume biography of DWB.

Bob Hanson
Loganville, GA


-----Original Message-----
From: Warren Stephens <wdstephens@...>
To: main@SouthernRailway.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2020 12:41 pm
Subject: [SouthernRailway] Mose Siskin part 2

As for who ran the TAG, the TAG had a series of absentee owners. The investor Russell Sage, the railroad investor Newman Erb and the Coverdale syndicate. Only Siskin and earlier the Chambliss syndicate, were local. Of the last three presidents - or day to day managers- of TAG, two were former Southern executives. The last was former SOU ex. vp Macon Tollison.

Warren D. Stephens