locked Need timetable help


Jim King
 

I’m looking for Asheville Division timetables from the teens, 20s, 30s, up to mid 40s, for a Murphy Branch project.  Photocopies are welcome or I can scan your original and return it with a scan file for your records.  Asheville Division may have been called something else at one time.  I’ve also read that the Murphy Branch was called Murphy Division “way back when”.

 

No luck with railroad book dealers (Railpub, Ron’s), ebay or Amazon.

 

Jim King

http://smokymountainmodelworks.com/

 


O Fenton Wells
 

Don't think I have anything that old but will check
Fenton

On Wed, Aug 31, 2022 at 11:43 PM Jim King <jimking3@...> wrote:

I’m looking for Asheville Division timetables from the teens, 20s, 30s, up to mid 40s, for a Murphy Branch project.  Photocopies are welcome or I can scan your original and return it with a scan file for your records.  Asheville Division may have been called something else at one time.  I’ve also read that the Murphy Branch was called Murphy Division “way back when”.

 

No luck with railroad book dealers (Railpub, Ron’s), ebay or Amazon.

 

Jim King

http://smokymountainmodelworks.com/

 



--
Fenton Wells
250 Frye Rd
Pinehurst NC 28374
910-420-8106
srrfan1401@...


aramsay18
 

Hello Jim and ALCON

I have Southern passenger service timetables back to the 1890s.

In a 1950 Southern passenger timetable there is freight service only to Murphy NC.  No Murphy division is listed. There are a number of passenger service trains to/from Asheville NC but nothing uniquely Asheville division (the Asheville Division is listed frequently together with others providing service to numerous destinations in the Southern system). However there was the Asheville Special Coach and Pullman (Table J1) originating in Boston MA (on the New York, New Haven and Hartford Railroad) connecting to the PRR in New York, then on the PRR and onto the Southern in Washington, then to Asheville with quite a number of intermediate points.

In the Oct. 1907 and Sept. 1908 Southern passenger service timetables there are listings for the "Murphy Division" which shows passenger service between Asheville and Murphy NC with quite a few intermediate points.  There are several other listings relevant to Asheville. Only the one listing for Murphy NC (the Murphy Division).

In the June 1905 and August 1906 Southern passenger service timetables the "Murphy Division" was listed as the "Asheville Division" providing service Asheville/Murphy.

Evidently from the timetables the "Asheville Division" changed to the "Murphy Division" circa 1907.

I'll speculate that when passenger service to Murphy NC was dropped, Southern changed the division name changed back to "Asheville Division" but I won't be able to narrow down a date range for a week or so. (I see part of the former "Murphy Branch" is in use today but in different ownership.)

Timetables aimed at the tourist trade titled "Principal Cities and Resorts of the South" in 1898, 1902, 1903, 1904, and 1910 list Asheville as a point of service but in a higher level context (principal cities), lacking anything about Murphy and associated details I imagine you want.

Shortly I will have Southern passenger service timetables at hand for 1920, 1929, 1932,  1935, 1940, and 1944. (Passenger service to Murphy and intermediate points may have been reinstated during the war.)  I'll pass along those results if that helps.

There is a lot of history concerning the "Murphy Branch," including the Southern's predecessors Richmond and Danville and the WNCR.  You might want to refer to this book "George, Michael. Southern Railway's Murphy Branch. Collegedale TN: The College Press, 1996."  There are used softcover copies for sale $19.95 on AbeBooks at this link:


If you want timetable details, I can take pictures/make scans of whatever is relevant  (I have a large flatbed scanner.)

Best Regards from Berryville VA

Andrew Ramsay


On Thu, Sep 1, 2022 at 6:52 AM O Fenton Wells <srrfan1401@...> wrote:
Don't think I have anything that old but will check
Fenton

On Wed, Aug 31, 2022 at 11:43 PM Jim King <jimking3@...> wrote:

I’m looking for Asheville Division timetables from the teens, 20s, 30s, up to mid 40s, for a Murphy Branch project.  Photocopies are welcome or I can scan your original and return it with a scan file for your records.  Asheville Division may have been called something else at one time.  I’ve also read that the Murphy Branch was called Murphy Division “way back when”.

 

No luck with railroad book dealers (Railpub, Ron’s), ebay or Amazon.

 

Jim King

http://smokymountainmodelworks.com/

 



--
Fenton Wells
250 Frye Rd
Pinehurst NC 28374
910-420-8106
srrfan1401@...


Tom Seay
 

Passenger service from Asheville to Murphy NC ended 15 July 1948.  The Great Smoky Mountains Railroad operates tourist excursions out of Bryson City NC.  

—Tom Seay
Bryson City NC

 


Warren Stephens
 

I wonder if Southern ever contemplated passenger motorcar service over this line? 

Warren D. Stephens

On Friday, September 2, 2022 at 08:40:45 PM EDT, Tom Seay via groups.io <duckamuck@...> wrote:


Passenger service from Asheville to Murphy NC ended 15 July 1948.  The Great Smoky Mountains Railroad operates tourist excursions out of Bryson City NC.  

—Tom Seay
Bryson City NC

 


George Eichelberger
 

Warren:

The individual file on trains 17-18 (Asheville-Murphy) includes 48 documents that have been scanned so far. Someone needs to read through it again but I do not recall anything about motor car services. Post war, the Southern had one “plan” for passenger services of any kind….cutting them off!

All of the (scanned) “Individual Train files” will be accessible, if time permits, when the archives is open during the joint SRHA/L&NHS convention and RPM meet to registered attendees (the archives will be closed otherwise). For anyone planning on making a day trip to Chattanooga on Saturday 9-30, the one-day RPM fee is $25.00. That includes entry to any of the clinics, TVRM model railroad layout and the SRHA/L&NHS archives. (There will not be enough manpower available to help with individual research during the convention. There WILL be a mini clinic on “Using prototype documentation” at various times in the archives.)

The “Individual Train files” directory includes 5,375 items (8.49GB):

General Info Train Discontinuances
KC-Florida Spl
L&N, TC & NC&StL
Memphis Spl 1914
Other Road's passenger svcs
Pass Tr consists
Pass schedules (multiple trains)
Passenger Train Disc Status
Passenger Trains - general
Pickens Xplorer
Pullman Operations
SAL-ACL-SCL Passenger Services
SEPC and State PUCs
Seminole
Sou Pac
Sou-PRR-PC joint service
Tr 1-2 Crescent
Tr 1-2 New Albany-Princeton, IN
Tr 1-2 Ponce
Tr 1-2 Sheffield-Parrish
Tr 1-2 St Louis-Louisville
Tr 1-2, 3-4 (mail alts)
Tr 1-28, 2-27 appl to disc Cincy-Atlanta & Oakdale-Columbia
Tr 1-28, 2-27 appl to disc Pullman line 2254 Asheville-Tryon, NC
Tr 1-28, 2-27 appl to disc Pullman line 2254 Asheville-Tryon, NC Cover
Tr 101-102 Mixed Knoxville-Maryville 
Tr 107-108 Nancy Hanks
Tr 11, 12, 14 & 21 Harrisonburg Branch  
Tr 11-12 & 7-14 Richmond-Danville, VA
Tr 11-12 Asheville-Salisbury
Tr 11-12 Atl-Bham
Tr 11-12 Columbia-Charleston
Tr 11-12-141-142 Monroe-Grnvl
Tr 11-14 Birmingham-Columbus, MS
Tr 11-16 Bham-Columbus, GA
Tr 111-112-13-14 Raleigh Gbo
Tr 122, 123, 124, 125 Cochran-Hawkinsville, GA
Tr 13 & 14 Tr 1-2 Sheffield-Parrish
Tr 13-14 GS&F Valdosta-Palatka mixed
Tr 13-14 Richmond Danville
Tr 13-14 Winston-Salem - Wilksboro
Tr 135 Tocccoa, GA
Tr 141-142 Union-Lockhart, SC
Tr 15 & 16 Gbo-Asheville
Tr 15-16 Asheville-Salisbury
Tr 15-16 Cincinnati-Chattanooga
Tr 15-16 Mixed Tecumseh-Wilton and Wilton-Selma, AL
Tr 15-16 in AL
Tr 15-16 in Ky
Tr 17-18 & 115-116 Mixed  Selma-Akron & Selma Demopolis 
Tr 17-18 Ashe-Murphy
Tr 17-18 Augusta-Branchville 
Tr 17-18 Birmingham Spl
Tr 17-18 Macon-Vidalia (Last psgr train on MD&S)
Tr 17-18 Somerset-Pine Knot
Tr 17-18 via Bristol and Roanoke
Tr 17-45 + 18-46 (with N&W)
Tr 19-21-22 Atl Columbus
Tr 21-22 Greensboro-Goldsboro
Tr 21-22 Raleigh-Goldsboro
Tr 21-22 Salisbury-Charlotte
Tr 23-24 Louisville-Danville, KY
Tr 23-24 in Ill and IN
Tr 24-25 Atlanta-Columbus, GA
Tr 24-9 Skyland Spl
Tr 25-26 Chatt-Washington 1914
Tr 26 GS&F
Tr 27-28
Tr 29 Atlanta-DC
Tr 29-30 Bham-Atl
Tr 3-4 Mixed Toccoa-Elberton, GA
Tr 31-32 Atl-Chattanooga
Tr 31-32 Augusta-Special
Tr 31-32 Disc
Tr 31-32 in SC
Tr 33
Tr 34, 35 & 36 "Piedmont"
Tr 34-35 Raleigh-Greensboro
Tr 35-36 Ashe-Knox (1914)
Tr 35-36 Ft Valley, GA
Tr 36 Atl-WDC
Tr 36-36-135-136 Marion Rock Hill
Tr 37-38 Carolina Spl
Tr 37-38 L&N, A&WP, Sou Crescent
Tr 38 Crescent
Tr 39-30 Sals-Atl
Tr 4-5 (G&F) Augusta-Valdosta
Tr 4-5 Florida Sunbeam
Tr 40 "New Yorker"
Tr 41-42 "Pelican"
Tr 41-42 Chatt-York, AL
Tr 41-49 Monroe-DC
Tr 43-44 Atl-north
Tr 43-44 NOLA-Cincinnati
Tr 44 Atl-GBO  (1914)
Tr 45-46 Seminole & City of Miami
Tr 45-46 Tennesseean
Tr 47-48 "Cracker"
Tr 47-48 "Southener"
Tr 5-6 Mixed Lula-Athens, GA 
Tr 5-6 New Royal Palm
Tr 5-6 Piedmont
Tr 5-6 Rome
Tr 5-8 Greensboro- W-S
Tr 7 & 8 Bham to Columbus, MS
Tr 7-8 Atlanta-Brunswick
Tr 7-8 Chattanooga-Tuscumbia, AL
Tr 71-170 Coryton-Cumberland Gap mixed
Tr 76-77 Clinton-Jellico, TN
Tr 8-15 Rome-Chatt 1915 Box 21 File 301 Disc 
Tr 9-10 Man O'War
Tr 9-10 Mixed Bulls Gap-Rogersville
Wash Sunset Rte Ad 1907Scan-191018-0001.jpg
containerized mail (mty to Intermodal)
tr 3-4 Chatt to Valdosta

Ike




On Sep 3, 2022, at 11:03 AM, Warren Stephens <wdstephens@...> wrote:

I wonder if Southern ever contemplated passenger motorcar service over this line? 

Warren D. Stephens

On Friday, September 2, 2022 at 08:40:45 PM EDT, Tom Seay via groups.io <duckamuck@...> wrote:


Passenger service from Asheville to Murphy NC ended 15 July 1948.  The Great Smoky Mountains Railroad operates tourist excursions out of Bryson City NC.  

—Tom Seay
Bryson City NC

 


George Eichelberger
 



On Sep 3, 2022, at 12:50 PM, George Eichelberger <geichelberger@...> wrote:

Warren:

The individual file on trains 17-18 (Asheville-Murphy) includes 48 documents that have been scanned so far. Someone needs to read through it again but I do not recall anything about motor car services. Post war, the Southern had one “plan” for passenger services of any kind….cutting them off!

All of the (scanned) “Individual Train files” will be accessible, if time permits, when the archives is open during the joint SRHA/L&NHS convention and RPM meet to registered attendees (the archives will be closed otherwise). For anyone planning on making a day trip to Chattanooga on Saturday 9-30, the one-day RPM fee is $25.00. That includes entry to any of the clinics, TVRM model railroad layout and the SRHA/L&NHS archives. (There will not be enough manpower available to help with individual research during the convention. There WILL be a mini clinic on “Using prototype documentation” at various times in the archives.)

The “Individual Train files” directory includes 5,375 items (8.49GB):

General Info Train Discontinuances
KC-Florida Spl
L&N, TC & NC&StL
Memphis Spl 1914
Other Road's passenger svcs
Pass Tr consists
Pass schedules (multiple trains)
Passenger Train Disc Status
Passenger Trains - general
Pickens Xplorer
Pullman Operations
SAL-ACL-SCL Passenger Services
SEPC and State PUCs
Seminole
Sou Pac
Sou-PRR-PC joint service
Tr 1-2 Crescent
Tr 1-2 New Albany-Princeton, IN
Tr 1-2 Ponce
Tr 1-2 Sheffield-Parrish
Tr 1-2 St Louis-Louisville
Tr 1-2, 3-4 (mail alts)
Tr 1-28, 2-27 appl to disc Cincy-Atlanta & Oakdale-Columbia
Tr 1-28, 2-27 appl to disc Pullman line 2254 Asheville-Tryon, NC
Tr 1-28, 2-27 appl to disc Pullman line 2254 Asheville-Tryon, NC Cover
Tr 101-102 Mixed Knoxville-Maryville 
Tr 107-108 Nancy Hanks
Tr 11, 12, 14 & 21 Harrisonburg Branch  
Tr 11-12 & 7-14 Richmond-Danville, VA
Tr 11-12 Asheville-Salisbury
Tr 11-12 Atl-Bham
Tr 11-12 Columbia-Charleston
Tr 11-12-141-142 Monroe-Grnvl
Tr 11-14 Birmingham-Columbus, MS
Tr 11-16 Bham-Columbus, GA
Tr 111-112-13-14 Raleigh Gbo
Tr 122, 123, 124, 125 Cochran-Hawkinsville, GA
Tr 13 & 14 Tr 1-2 Sheffield-Parrish
Tr 13-14 GS&F Valdosta-Palatka mixed
Tr 13-14 Richmond Danville
Tr 13-14 Winston-Salem - Wilksboro
Tr 135 Tocccoa, GA
Tr 141-142 Union-Lockhart, SC
Tr 15 & 16 Gbo-Asheville
Tr 15-16 Asheville-Salisbury
Tr 15-16 Cincinnati-Chattanooga
Tr 15-16 Mixed Tecumseh-Wilton and Wilton-Selma, AL
Tr 15-16 in AL
Tr 15-16 in Ky
Tr 17-18 & 115-116 Mixed  Selma-Akron & Selma Demopolis 
Tr 17-18 Ashe-Murphy
Tr 17-18 Augusta-Branchville 
Tr 17-18 Birmingham Spl
Tr 17-18 Macon-Vidalia (Last psgr train on MD&S)
Tr 17-18 Somerset-Pine Knot
Tr 17-18 via Bristol and Roanoke
Tr 17-45 + 18-46 (with N&W)
Tr 19-21-22 Atl Columbus
Tr 21-22 Greensboro-Goldsboro
Tr 21-22 Raleigh-Goldsboro
Tr 21-22 Salisbury-Charlotte
Tr 23-24 Louisville-Danville, KY
Tr 23-24 in Ill and IN
Tr 24-25 Atlanta-Columbus, GA
Tr 24-9 Skyland Spl
Tr 25-26 Chatt-Washington 1914
Tr 26 GS&F
Tr 27-28
Tr 29 Atlanta-DC
Tr 29-30 Bham-Atl
Tr 3-4 Mixed Toccoa-Elberton, GA
Tr 31-32 Atl-Chattanooga
Tr 31-32 Augusta-Special
Tr 31-32 Disc
Tr 31-32 in SC
Tr 33
Tr 34, 35 & 36 "Piedmont"
Tr 34-35 Raleigh-Greensboro
Tr 35-36 Ashe-Knox (1914)
Tr 35-36 Ft Valley, GA
Tr 36 Atl-WDC
Tr 36-36-135-136 Marion Rock Hill
Tr 37-38 Carolina Spl
Tr 37-38 L&N, A&WP, Sou Crescent
Tr 38 Crescent
Tr 39-30 Sals-Atl
Tr 4-5 (G&F) Augusta-Valdosta
Tr 4-5 Florida Sunbeam
Tr 40 "New Yorker"
Tr 41-42 "Pelican"
Tr 41-42 Chatt-York, AL
Tr 41-49 Monroe-DC
Tr 43-44 Atl-north
Tr 43-44 NOLA-Cincinnati
Tr 44 Atl-GBO  (1914)
Tr 45-46 Seminole & City of Miami
Tr 45-46 Tennesseean
Tr 47-48 "Cracker"
Tr 47-48 "Southener"
Tr 5-6 Mixed Lula-Athens, GA 
Tr 5-6 New Royal Palm
Tr 5-6 Piedmont
Tr 5-6 Rome
Tr 5-8 Greensboro- W-S
Tr 7 & 8 Bham to Columbus, MS
Tr 7-8 Atlanta-Brunswick
Tr 7-8 Chattanooga-Tuscumbia, AL
Tr 71-170 Coryton-Cumberland Gap mixed
Tr 76-77 Clinton-Jellico, TN
Tr 8-15 Rome-Chatt 1915 Box 21 File 301 Disc 
Tr 9-10 Man O'War
Tr 9-10 Mixed Bulls Gap-Rogersville
Wash Sunset Rte Ad 1907Scan-191018-0001.jpg
containerized mail (mty to Intermodal)
tr 3-4 Chatt to Valdosta

Ike




On Sep 3, 2022, at 11:03 AM, Warren Stephens <wdstephens@...> wrote:

I wonder if Southern ever contemplated passenger motorcar service over this line? 

Warren D. Stephens

On Friday, September 2, 2022 at 08:40:45 PM EDT, Tom Seay via groups.io <duckamuck@...> wrote:


Passenger service from Asheville to Murphy NC ended 15 July 1948.  The Great Smoky Mountains Railroad operates tourist excursions out of Bryson City NC.  

—Tom Seay
Bryson City NC

 



Stephen Warner
 

Railroad Magazine in the 30's or 40's had a story about the division.  Yes, it was a separate division based in Bryson City (I assume the depot there is still the same?) - the DS up and down a few more time between the hills.  I may have the magazine around here somewhere.  The write was pretty well known on Southern, worked later and retired at Marion and Old Fort as Operator, after DS at Bryson City (Frank Clodfelter?  Not sure).